The only use case of gold is electronics. Jewellery is a storage solution for gold.
Bitcoin, by evidence of the 3 million altcoins is not easily replaceable and is an Internet version of gold.
Land is the true ultimate asset. It is finite, has utility and is divisible. Its limitation is its fungibility, which is why it has never been used as money.
Gold and Bitcoin will share the stage going into the oncoming final collapse, with old timers hanging on to gold and the new kids holding Bitcoin.
Of course it is electronics.
Its easy, if bitcoin dies today, you have litecoin, you have bitcoin cash, you have zecash, all the same with different approuches.
I agree with you land is the ultimate and then gold.
Gold and bitcoin will only share the stage if the environment is good, in bad environment like what we live today, and what we will live if nothing changes in 5 year bitcoin will never get close to gold.
Bitcoin is the solid foundation for all other cryptos if Bitcoin dies, no other crypto survives.
Bitcoin, aside from an EMP pulse from the sun, will attain parity with gold within the next 5 years. My personal opinion is it will attain and surpass golds monetary value a lot sooner than that, but gold will also dramatically increase from its current value.
We have about $200 trillion of weak money to replace with hard money, that will be shared, mostly between gold and Bitcoin. I think Bitcoin will take the lions share, but gold will not be insignificant.
How can you be sure of that?
The only coin i see going side by side with gold is Monero, look to the charts, then look to it with bitcoin.
Bitcoin is going side by side with stocks indexes as im observing.
I think you know that 200 trilions of weak money will only move to bitcoin if they succeed in controling the chain..
30,000 hours of study and 30 years of building global public companies and 30 years of building the technology your using to communicate with me right now.
The same way Novak Djokovic is always going to beat you at Tennis, he's studied and played tennis more than you have.
That doesn't prove nothing, but yeah you have baggage to talk real.
I also building businesses and studying hard as fuck, maybe when i have you age i will be at least at your level, or cant i get there?
It because im younger than you and dont have the same years of experience that i cant have a different vision or my vision is the wrong one?
If i was tennist why couldnt i win to Novak if i trained harder than him?
Mike, dont go that way, you reveil weakness with it, there are people out there with half of your age doing greater things than you did.
There is also luck and starting position. My father building a group of public companies gave me a huge head start, so yes, perhaps when you reach my age, you still won't be able to be as successful, perhaps you'll be more successful.
This is an intrinsic unfairness.
Perhaps, this little discussion will help you push yourself to want to be the best you can be.
Roger Federa is a much more successful tennis player than I am, Jack Dorsey is a much more successful builder of social media technologies than I am, Elon Musk is a much better car and rocket builder than I am. None of them have any success in any the domains I have been involved in.
Don't confuse domain success.
You dont know my roots, but by what im seeing coming from a man of your age, they didnt teach you to be humble, and that says it all...
You dont know my family, you dont know where i start, maybe yeah you have that intrinsic unfairness, or maybe im the one that has. who knows,,
It was not by case that i open my first business with 26 years in the pandemic environment.
Dont confuse domain success with knowledge, and i saw enough, and im not here to compare my family to yours, because maybe you will have a surprise when you know my roots.
Don't humiliate yourself, you dont need it.
You feel bad, you've just gone toe to toe with a second division footballer and didn't expect him to play to his full ability.
I have no interest in you or your background, in the same way you have no interest in mine.
Humiliation is not part of my language or modus operandi, I apologise if you assumed I would understand what you mean by this.
I hope you are able to understand that sometimes, just sometimes, the other person is not the same.
Enjoy your own journey, you have no need to be interested in me at all, I am old and will die a very happy man long before you. In that respect you win.
Enjoy your own life as much as you can and stop caring about what I, or anybody else thinks, but perhaps try to learn what I, or others know, because that can be useful.
Im not feeling bad, but you are assuming thing without knowing almost nothing about my life and my family.
Thats what i do, but i know that i can learn things from the janitor to the CEO, but im seeing that you dont have the same vision and i have about learning.
You started to use arguments outside of the scope, using fallacies and using your family to endorse your name, and i never did it.
It is not my intention to humiliate you or make you feel bad.
But if you ask a second division footballer to tackle you head on in a game, don't become disillusioned when you are unable to prevent him scoring a goal.
Appreciate your patience going back and forth with these people
They need to be humiliated. They sit on here and shit on bitcoin all day long with the hope that they can convince some of us to move our value into a shitcoin
This clown even tried to claim that bitcoin cash or Kaspa are better options than bitcoin ha
some people can read, but some can't understand...
You still scared about that BIS paper or was that some other Monero �
Was definitely the same guy đ¤Ł
Itâs so funny to me that the Monero guys are so scared of these fiat institutions
https://primal.net/e/nevent1qqsvxf3rhp5vcamtz44zxe4sglmnu9sarhx78z59pfvt8h3m6utcdxgrgg3rt
What BIS paper? What happened? LOL
Canât seem to find it but nostr:nprofile1qqsxuzslfpfteray9wqy04s2sxfsmzysfj3l9txlkkuyzw4ce86yfegprpmhxw309a3h2um5dakjuenfv96x5ctx9e3k7mf0qyv8wue69uhk56twvakx2tnwdaehgunkv4ezuum99ukcalnu was on here last month railing against bitcoin and claiming it was a failure because some BIS proposal to force KYC on self custody wallets
Kaspa shouldnât be viewed as a âbetterâ option. Itâs not a âbetterâ store of value. But it is a revolutionary tech as a fair-launched, POW, open source protocol with block speeds of 10bps. The possibilities are endless for use cases. Especially as tokenization and stable coins grow. Dismissing it entirely is unwise.
Nice try! Kaspa is a shitcoin that has zero use case other than enriching the insidersâŚtrying to remember the shitcoiner that was pumping it a few years ago. Was it Carl moonboi or something?
https://primal.net/e/nevent1qqsxqk6c4x9v67vlgy46wfkfjwv7hug2ekudffrsxafpchec266epxsrd3gs3
I think Iâm confusing kasta with kaspa ha
Just so much shit out there. Feel bad for the people that still believe in âcryptoâ
The simple notion that youâre not in the slightest curious to seek to understand is the same mentality that kept Boomers from buying Bitcoin. You called it a shitcoin before you had any idea what youâre referring to. This is worshipping a religion, my friend.
They are all shitcoins ha
I donât need to have any curiosity about the next big shitcoin. I am not here to gamble. I try to spend less than I make and any excess gets saved in bitcoin. My savings arenât going to be moved into Kaspa because it has faster block times and can do more on the base layer
Bitcoin fixes the moneyâŚeverything else is a useless distraction.
You realize youâre saying itâs a useless distraction and you donât have the slightest clue what it is, right?
Youâre guilty of the same thing the Boomers are for dismissing Bitcoin. Itâs sad to see.
So much for decentralization, P2P, self-sovereignty, etc. Can somebody remind me what the hash is of the lightening network?
This is a nonobjective argument. Pure emotion and opinion.
Best of luck with Kaspa!
My point exactly. Say shitcoin a couple of times, offer baseless opinion or repost a Kratter lie, and then run away from objective conversation.
You can shill Kaspa all you want and believe that it is a fair launch and competes with Bitcoin and all the other talking points you get from the shitcoin marketing department. I have heard it all beforeâŚ
I have no interest in another âcryptoâ. Kaspa will be the next NEO or NANO in 5 years
Again best of luck.
Itâs not a belief, guy. The source code was openly published on GitHub on Nov 7, 2021- and at that time the Genesis block was created. Iâm not getting any taking points from anybody and thereâs no marketing department. Youâre making all of my points. You have no idea what youâre talking about. You donât objectively assess anything. Youâre parroting what others have told you.
Youâll likely quit responding out of pride now that you realize that youâre wrong. This happens time and time again.
Your talking points are the same I have seen over and over and over again from every other crypto personâŚyou guys find every excuse to trash bitcoin so you can dump your bags on people that donât know any better. You are either a scumbag that knows you are scamming people or an idiot for buying into their scam.
What is wrong with Bitcoin that we need Kaspa so bad? Why should I sell my Bitcoin to buy the shitcoin you are trying to shill on here?
Again bitcoin fixes the money and everything else is a distraction. I donât need faster block times or functionality at the base layer for my money. We can get functionality and speed in second and third layers if we need it but I want my money to be rock solid and not able to be manipulated by anyone
Cleary theyâre not because you didnât know if was fair launched or youâre just incredibly dense.
I didnât trash Bitcoin at all. I own Bitcoin. More than I do Kaspa. I actually said Bitcoin is the best store of value. Your intellectual dishonesty, pride, or intelligence is astounding. Iâll let you decide which it is.
What about the 2 weeks kaspa was "offline" and the insiders kept mining for themselves and this was covered up?
It was not covered up. They mined to a burn address that is viewable today. All blocks are cryptographically verifiable. This has been discussed ad nauseam.
What about the time in 2010 when somebody created 184 million Bitcoin? Can you apply your logic evenly?
In 2010 bitcoin was still an experiment and it had no value. Not apples to apples comparison but you will continue to argue in bad faith
How many years old was Bitcoin in 2010?
And how many years old was Kaspa when some transaction data was lost?
Bitcoin was the firstâŚit had time to grow organically and figure itself out before it had value.
Anything that is going to replace bitcoin has to be âperfectâ from day 1 which I do not personally think is possible. Kaspa having downtime and allowing early users to mine a shitload of extra coins is an automatic disqualification
Best of luck trying to find the next âBitcoinâ
I donât see a number of years old? Didnât answer the question.
Again, learn to read. I said nothing about replacing Bitcoin.
âAllowing early miners to mine a shit ton of Kaspaâ⌠Do you have any idea how much Bitcoin early miners own? I wouldnât make that argument if I were you. Do your homework.
Again, learn to read. I didnât say it was the next Bitcoin. Iâve already said Bitcoin is the best store of value. Are you ok?
âFair launchedâ lol
Your a đ¤Ą
Prove me wrong.
Again, subjective and emotional insults. Inability to critically assess in an objective manner. Knee jerk reactions to think I hate Bitcoin and am telling him he should sell his Bitcoin. Unfortunately, but typical of the ignorant Bitcoin maxi worshiper.
Never once did I say sell your Bitcoin. Learn to read.
Answer my questionsâŚbuying Kaspa means I am not buying bitcoin. you shilling this shitcoin and telling me to buy it instead of Bitcoin is essentially the same as telling me to sell my Bitcoin to allocate to your worthless shitcoin
Just so you know, thereâs not a question in that post.
I can see where you would have a hard time comprehending what Iâm saying.
What is wrong with Bitcoin that we need Kaspa so bad? Why should I sell my Bitcoin to buy the shitcoin you are trying to shill on here?
I never said anything is wrong with Bitcoin. I said itâs the best store of value and it canât scale on the base layer.
I never said sell Bitcoin for Kaspa. Thatâs your semantics.
Nobody is saying it scales at the base layer which is why I use lightning
Why should I buy Kaspa? And again buying Kaspa instead of Bitcoin is essentially the same as selling Bitcoin to buy your shitcoin
Do you value permissionless money? Do you value POW? Do you value self sovereignty?
Yup and bitcoin provides me all 3!
Again donât need your Kaspa shitcoin for any of those
Whenâs the last time you paid for dinner or a coffee with Bitcoin?
I use bitcoin as money all the fucking timeâŚnice try though
When is the last time you have used Kaspa to buy dinner or coffee? đ¤Ą
https://primal.net/e/nevent1qqsg8quq6hh0rrg36mluj9gklzzrh973l3qdq0dslap28sluevtd92gd5tteg
Again, you didnât answer the question. I can is the point. We are only beginning to transition into a larger digital economy.
I answered the question.
I buy pecan butter and chocolates from nostr:nprofile1qqswp94gnm4epqsgjkndl4lnd8krzdj5u4mzuppdtxksdymkty63g7gpz3mhxue69uhhyetvv9ujuerpd46hxtnfduq3qamnwvaz7tmwdaehgu3wd3skueq6259m3 pretty frequently so that can be considered dinner
Ordering something and making a real time payment are different. Again, youâre being intellectually dishonest. Thereâs a reason nostr:nprofile1qqsvf646uxlreajhhsv9tms9u6w7nuzeedaqty38z69cpwyhv89ufcqpzpmhxue69uhkummnw3ezuamfdejszxrhwden5te0wfjkccte9eekummjwsh8xmmrd9skck2rlgn implemented stable coins with Strike. Worst of all, on the Tron network.
You are insufferable
Best of luck with kaspa! Hope it makes you rich and all your hopes and dreams come true! I will continue to stay humble and stack sats and call out shitcoins shills like you
I would advise you to do some homework first. At least then you can be objective and demonstrate some knowledge on the subject.
My man, appreciate you very much! â¤ď¸đŤĄ
Do you value authenticity, decentralization, and autonomy in communication?
Moving goalpostsâŚ
Not at all. Everybody and their brother (hyperbole) is being arrested in Europe for online speech.
What does that have to do with bitcoin vs Kaspa lol
Again, itâs not vs. Iâm genuinely concerned about your reading comprehension. Kasia.fyi is an example. More thorough platforms will grow from here.
âI like bitcoin but buy my shitcoinâ
Well, itâs open sourced is the thing. So itâs not mine.
âI like bitcoin but buy OUR shitcoinâ
Better?
Again, your pride and intellectual dishonesty is very sad.
Sorry you feel that way
The fact you feel the need to shill a shitcoin on here would indicate you are the one that has some intellectual dishonestly
Very sad
I feel the need to speak truth. Especially when somebody, like yourself, is uninformed and incorrect on so much.
Don't humiliate yourself more mike, you dont need this.
The one's playing in Champions don't even need to talk they play at Champions, but the one's that play in the second divions when they think they are talking to someone from a division below, they talk exacly like you are talking to me.
Mike Tyson became the best boxer of a generation, possibly of all time because he had a unique trait. He enjoyed the pain of being hit.
I have to disappoint you, the part you are trying to hurt in me doesn't exist. Even worse, I am thoroughly enjoying this interaction, while I am aware that you are not.
Same mistake, you like to assuming things without knowing, im also having fun to discuss with you, and im not trying to hurt you, why do you think that?
Brilliant, then let's carry on.
Where would you like to go now?
i put my points on the table already, go look to charts and see the correlation of monero with gold, and then see the same with bitcoin.
then see the same charts against stock indexes, and tell me if im the only one seeing that monero follows gold, and bitcoin folllows stocks
You want me to do more research?
OK sure, I'll be right back đ
I'm not going to shit on Monero, if you want privacy, choose Monero, if you want a store of value choose Bitcoin.
I am not against Moneros use case.
of couse i want you sincere opinion, i have you like a wise person, you are not like the ones that only talk empty words, you do your reaserches, like i do mine, and i love to discuss with people that can think with their own mind and take there own opinions.
Understood, as you can tell from my profile, I don't choose privacy, despite that being a key feature of NOSTR.
Therefore privacy coins have very little interest for me personally.
There is a valid use case for Moneros privacy features and it is the best in class at what it does.
What are your thoughts on the recent Qubic attack?
Now we are talking, from the same position, in the ideas world, i like this way.
I also don't choose privacy here on nostr, the ones here since the beggining know my face and enough to find me if they want.
That's true Monero is the standard on privacy coins, we can agree with it, and i like or choose Monero because im not on crypto to get the best % of gains ok? I choose Monero because i think in the worst conditions it will be the easiest to use, you understand me?
I also know that any business make a lot more % of gains by money invested if done right, you agree with me?
My toughs is that Qubic attack showed the resilience of the chain and the monero community, that my conclusion, because all monerist unite together to run our nodes and mine it 24/7 and they until now they didnt win in controlling the chain, but i also think that we need to improve it, and it was on plans and being build before the attack started.
That's about as much insight or discussion you're going to get from me on Monero.
I personally have little interest in it as discussed before.
I do own a small quantity of it and I do run a Monero node and I do let my Fedora Workstation mine Monero when it's not busy crunching its LLM.
But none of that occupies much of my time or thought.
I am in no way an expert in Monero.
What conclusions you take from my first question?
I appreciate you are interested in Monero, but I am not.
I don't wish to allocate a significant part of my time or intellect to pursue a discussion.
Man, it takes litteraly 5/10 minutes to do it, you already wasted more of you time discussing things that dont matter with me.
I though you wanted to do real talk, but if you dont, dont waste my time.
You dont need to be an expert in monero to find correlations in charts.
We are not the same đ
Im seeing that we really are not the same, while i wanted a honest discuss, you dont!
But what are your thoughts on the BIS?
I think Iâm just going to start to troll all the Monero idiots on here like they like to troll bitcoiners
That it makes money exploiting the 3rd world?
You can learn a lot from Mike.
We all have our own lessons to learn.
Follow your calling not that of anybody else.
i know and i do, but he thinks that he cant learn from anyone, because his family is from the first division, and no one has nothing to teach them.
see all conversation...
I have a question, if bitcoin is the one changing the status quo and taking power away from govs and banks, why the state and banks didnt attack bitcoin like they do with monero?
Because it's a public blockchain. With difficulty tax offices can find out who owns Bitcoin and tax their gains accordingly.
Also it is genuinely decentralised and meets all the criteria for the Nash Equilibrium in game theory, so can't be stopped.
But if it is so powerfull why they dont try even to stop it, like they do with monero and they even support it, if it takes power away from them?
Technicly i dont agree with you in that one.
Bitcoin lacks one important thing decentralization of mining, you dont have rn real decentralization mining to sustain the chain if the condition of bitcoin are the same monero has, you need govs permission to sustain the mining as it is today.
Study game theory, it is deeply fascinating.
Study Network Effects, it is less interesting and less involved.
Interestingly, John Nash is a weak Satoshi candidate.
You show it all, i was naive to think i would get a honest conversation from a bitcoin maxi, but you show me again what you are trying to do
Huh?
i asked you an opinion in a thing that takes you 10 min to do, and you dont want to do it, because maybe your conclusions are the same as mine, and that's not expected from one maximalist...
Ok, sure. You know youâve really lost me now đ
Wise ones know who lost who...
Hey nostr:npub1aqakd28d95muqlg6h6nwrvqq5925n354prayckr424k49vzjds4s0c237n and nostr:npub1dc9p7jzjhj86g2uqgltq4qvnpkyfqn9r72kdlddcgyat3j05gnjsgjc8rz
I thought about this thread for several hours
It kinda hammers home the point that value is inter subjectiveâŚie if ur child is starving in an isolated desert ud prolly prefer bread instead of silver
Still I think, at least for me, gold represents value in the sense of financial stability and personal security and BTC represents value in the form of hope for a better future for everyoneâŚ.but both are rooted in the value of PoW
âŚunfortunately for gold itâs very physicality, that gold bugs often tout as itâs primary advantage over BTC, is also its greatest weakness that requires centralized abstraction (paper) for practical economic transaction
âŚ. For me personally any asset that is not based on PoW (a significant marginal cost of production) is doomed to lose its value over a long arc of time due to debasement (including monero which no doubt has value (privacy) in the short term)⌠but ima idgit and often wrongđ¤ˇđ˝ââď¸
Full disclosure: Iâm a fan of individualsâ right to transact in the asset they prefer⌠and for me personally I think both gold and btc are a notable improvement on our current credit based system fueled by its dependence on ever increasing consumption for the sake of expanding debt that can never be fully repaid and based on tokens that have a marginal cost of production of zero (u can choose the unit of account for the zerođ)
Agreed.
The sad thing for me is that most people when loosing an argument allow it to affect their hubris and want to win at the cost of being right.
I already stated that Monero is probably the best Privacy coin out there and even support it by running a copy of the blockchain.
Because I don't seek privacy for my own transactions, so spending time absorbing myself in Monero's technology would be about as interesting as PelĂŠ explaining the offside rule in football to me.
I am equally uninterested in football, boxing, tennis and Monero đ
Are you kidding nostr:npub1aqakd28d95muqlg6h6nwrvqq5925n354prayckr424k49vzjds4s0c237n ?
You agree in discuss with me, but you were the one that didnt answer to my first question, i ansered yours and i understoold why you choose to ask me the quibic thing, and still i answered.
I didn't check your background before our discussion yestarday, but now that i check its even worst, comming from a man of your level...
I didnt loose any argument, because you were not discussing the ideas, you were trying to measure the size of your dick, against a nobody compared to you, but that says it all about you as a person.
using arguments like ''my opinion is better than yours because i have 30 years of experience'' is not called winning arguments from where i came from...
nostr:npub1dc9p7jzjhj86g2uqgltq4qvnpkyfqn9r72kdlddcgyat3j05gnjsgjc8rz youâre humiliating yourself with your shitcoinery.
nostr:npub1aqakd28d95muqlg6h6nwrvqq5925n354prayckr424k49vzjds4s0c237n itâs nice to do good things and explain things to people, but Russo hasnât hit his rock bottom yet, so he isnât ready to accept help. Only when we confess and repent are we ready or deserving of forgiveness. Russo only deserves a mute until he learns enough to play nice with others.
You can tell heâs young and hasnât learned about respect by the way he talks about it.
Like Jesus said, if they rebuke you, turn and walk away and never look back.
đ¤Ą
Back to shilling MoneroâŚsomeone has bitcoin derangement syndrome
Where did Bitcoin hurt you?
Amen
I know, Iâm having such a hard time understanding why gold bugs canât get over the bitcoin hump. Selling gold is such a pain. I think especially once bitcoin becomes quantum resistant, you really canât beat it.
Bitcoin dies if you have a major EMP sun flare. Many people value their CDs or vinyl over the streamed music that has replaced it.
Physical property has advantages, but Bitcoins ability to move instantly around the world without permission, for most that understand it, is more compelling.
That's why gold is better than bitcoin as reserve money, because it works as MOE even if electronics dont work at all
And bitcoin is not that special besides being the first, there are plenty of coins that can be moved around the world without permission...
There are no crpto currencies that store value. There are tokens such as Ethereum, used to pay for NFTs and smart contracts (i.e. legal and art domains), there are stablecoins such as Tether which will die with fiat and there are attempts at improving Bitcoin that all fail because they don't understand Bitcoin.
I won't bother to discuss meme or settlement tokens đ
You know pretty well that im not talking about that kind of tokens, but im not naive to not know that there are other cryptos with the same base.
Bitcoin cash for example is the most similar to bitcoin, it only changes the approuch about the blocksize, the rest is the same.
Bitcoin cash has failed.
Starting at the same position as Bitcoin, it currently holds 1/300th the value of Bitcoin.
It has served Roger Ver very well as his private piggy bank. For him, it has been unbelievably successful.
It has big blocks, it turns out he didn't know you didn't need big blocks, a lesson Craig Wright failed to learn also.
Are you sure you want to argue the merits of Bitcoin cash? Perhaps Kaspa would be a better candidate?
Where it failed? Im seeing it working as their devs and community planned.
If Govs, Blackrocks and ETFs choose bitcoin cash instead of bitcoin, and if they say bitcoin is shit, and only bitcoin cash is the real one i dont think we would talk like this.
Im not saying with this conversation that Roger Ver is right or wrong neither im saying that bitcoin cash is the real bitcoin, because i dont agree with that vision.
Im showing examples of what works, nothing more nothing less,
It didn't fail for Roger and if everybody chose Bitcoin cash over Bitcoin tomorrow then it succeeds.
yeah, kaspa is a better example
i could use kaspa also, so dont take personal what im choosing as example
I spent 3 months full time deep diving it for a friend who invested in it. It is a genuine scam that nobody else has been able to identify.
I can provide the evidence in private if you wish.
I had the luxury of time and the curiosity to spend time understanding it better than anybody else has outside the Kapsa devs.
My friend sold his holding at around $0.16
I believe it is currently 0.05c
Not all altcoins are scams, Roger genuinely believes in Bitcoin Cash and Craig genuinely believes in BSV. That doesn't mean they are ever going to be successful for anybody but the team that launched the coins, although they can make traders a lot of money in the process.
There is deep complexity and nuance in even the simplest of things, few have the luxury of time to spend thinking about this.
Using spot price to discredit a project, especially a young one, is something Bitcoin Maxis should know better than doing. How many times did TradFi laugh at 85%+ draw downs in Bitcoin spot price⌠this is especially true for a fair-launched, open-sourced, POW protocol with a block speed of 10bps. Iâm shocked you would even mention spot price (especially out of context) to dismiss a project. Thatâs what Boomers do when Bitcoin corrects.
There's only one thing old people hate more than the government and that is computers.
The âoncoming final collapseâ Mike!!
I was looking forward to a peaceful nightâs sleep but will have nightmares now đŹđŹđŹđą
That was a typo, I actually meant financial đ
Sorry to be the cause of your insomnia, blame my autocorrect đ
Liar, it is VERY useful if I want to take glittery shits after a four bottle Goldschläger bender.
