When any individual
living now or in the future,
can know *exactly* how much Monero is in circulation at any point during their life,
how is the supply "infinite?"
Discussion
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Because of the future additional supply,(tail emmision never goes to zero), so some bitcoiners discount the future of monero as infinite when you have infinite time.
Who here has infinite time?
In a world of immortals money plays an unimportant role, if it plays a role at all.
Some people look at a future for multiple generations. In this case it is more important as immortal money.
Monero has a lower inflation rate than gold. As is famous, gold still has the same purchasing power than it had 2000 years ago.
A hard cap is a stupid knee-jerk reaction to fiat insanity. Understandable, but ultimately poor monetary policy.
Of course, it's likely that the price of gold is being artificially suppressed and it should be two or three times higher than it is right now.
Gold failed at multiple things, like:
-store it safe
-transacting easy
-checking if the gold is real or fake
Because of this failing IOU'S where born. This lead eventually to fractional banking.
I'm not trying to make the case that gold is better money. I'm just saying that it didn't fail because it has supply inflation.
Furthermore, I'm saying that having a hard cap is not a necessary, even desirable, condition of hard money.
Why do you say hard cap is not desirable condition for hard money?
Because over time total productivity increases and the nominal cost of production falls. So you're always in the position of representing the value of *more stuff with the same quantity of money.
You end up disincentivizing economic activity because it's better to hold your money unless you have some surefire get rich scheme.
In other words, a little supply inflation is good acchually.
I am of the view that a lot of products are just bought because fiat doesn't gain or at least not loss purchasing power. I don't like the throwing away society. With a disinflationary currency, you will have less incentives to do so.
People will spend no matter how disinflationary the currency is because they need some food and other things. Nobody will do hunger strikes because the money is gaining purchasing power for example. People will be concious when they want to buy something.
Yes, I agree.
The difference is on this part with bitcoin: the people who transact will pay the cost instead of the holders.
there's no such thing as infinite time except as a mathematical abstraction.
A correct statement would be
"as time *approaches* infinity, the supply also *approaches* infinity."
maxis leave the first part out.
As I said, having a consistent tail emission isn't a problem for anybody in the present
or for anybody's descendants in the future.
I found a coin with even less supply than Bitcoin. If it's all about supply, here you go start stacking!
Good trolling 😂 On a serious note, you don't know the future supply of this shit because the founder could expand it.
You're holding two contradictory views at the same time. Does max supply matter or not?
Would take you 30 seconds to search and discover that Monero uses PoW just like Bitcoin. Walk me through how the "founder" would inflate supply.
Unless by that you mean they can mine like any other user?
My reaction is on your 42 coin.
In other words the supply of a coin isnt all that matters
A coin can have less supply, but still be absolute garbage
Supply matters, but trusting a founder or founders to not expand the supply is stupid. With bitcoin and monero you have a decentralized network of nodes that will not shoot in his own feet with changing the code to expand the supply more than the code tells now. I believe can not invent scarcity twice. The good things of monero could be build on top bitcoin.
"The good things of monero could be build on top bitcoin."
Patiently waiting 🕑💀
For onchain transactions it will probably not happen in a big way. On second layer it is in progress, lightning and cashu.
Cashu is custodial, Monero is not
Lightning is a UX nightmare for sovereign users, Monero is not
Not anywhere close to full replacements
I agree that the UX for lightning is not great as sovereign user at this moment but manageable. It definitely progressed a lot last year. Cashu is indeed custodial so in full trustless network it doesn’t work.
Just a question out of curiousity are there any trustless swaps between bitcoin and monero build now?
Where are now the main fiat ramps for monero?
I use both lightning and Cashu. Each has unique advantages and disadvantages, so I can't call them a replacement for the others.
Yes, trustless swaps:
Coming Soon:
https://github.com/decred/dcrdex
No-KYC fiat ramps:
Kraken, KuCoin, HodlHodl are centralized fiat ramps - KYC obviously
Do you know if this uses COMIT for Bitcoin to Monero swaps?
Unstoppable (and the new Feather plugin) both use COMIT
Yes, and BasicSwapDEX uses https://github.com/h4sh3d/xmr-btc-atomic-swap
Not sure how Serai and Decred are going to do it
#haveno and DFX.swiss or Onramper via nostr:npub1j9qyxka5lck4tw50v7qfrs6gdwczz5ydt7ugqy6nhuva9p6dpy5q8rs2yg
Havnt tried it myself but there is https://unstoppableswap.net/