Nostr Web Client

Kortik 🇦🇲

BIP47 a reusable payment code superior to BTCpayserver.

BIP47 code being deterministically generated means there is no DNS dependency, no requirement to be online, no leaving public keys on web servers, no need for constant interactivity.

This is superior to BTCPayServer, which requires a whole software stack and to be online.

Onchain observer cannot see how much sats I’ve received or from whom nor whom I’ve spent to. You might see several people follow/followed my paynym but this doesn’t mean there were any interaction between them.

Here is mine tell me who paid me or not?

And also one doesn’t know if this paynym is mine or not.

https://paynym.is/+coolglitter1A7

Being able to observe interactions between people on chain is a severe privacy downside to BIP 47. This would most certainly be enough ammo for the Canadian government to shut down bank accounts of likely donors to the truckers. It would be dangerous and irresponsible to say paynyms are a good solution for donations.

If you can host your own server, the privacy of generating new addresses on demand is superior.

Silent payments offer the best set of tradeoffs. Unfortunately Samourai has screamed too loudly about the downloading downside for light wallets, and as a result it looks like it'll never get adopted now. Unfortunate.

Good thing we have Monero.

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Discussion

Kortik 🇦🇲 2y ago

Here is my reusable payment code. Derive my addresses and who and where I sent or receive please?

PM8TJP7RYWNosUvkvj6zoV6QwhJLfQWc4fhVsp7ZWq1WR3HU3f4uUk2yuefEedzF97QMhcPfdphZEXyhWanh6ZgPUDVPmxjW9j51Wt2zHwgPvKVkdqxR

I can see all on chain txs of others who follow your paynym.

Kortik 🇦🇲 2y ago

Ok I shared my paynym code please let me know who I sent or received from

PM8TJP7RYWNosUvkvj6zoV6QwhJLfQWc4fhVsp7ZWq1WR3HU3f4uUk2yuefEedzF97QMhcPfdphZEXyhWanh6ZgPUDVPmxjW9j51Wt2zHwgPvKVkdqxR

You're deflecting from the core issue, which is that I can see all transactions subscribing to your paynym.

Kortik 🇦🇲 2y ago

Again I showed you my paynym let me see which tx you can see from my follow list. Can yuu show me those tx?

I know that it's possible but I haven't bothered to figure out how myself. What exactly are you trying to argue now, that it isn't possible or that I don't have skills? We both know it is possible.

Oh I think I see. You're playing word games with "followers" versus those who actually submit on chain txs to your paynym. Classic Samourai shill

noosphere888 🏴 2y ago

It's not possible. You're full of shit or straight up retarded.

Ahhh the Samourai treatment. Deflect and obfuscate and yell like a child.

Kortik 🇦🇲 2y ago

I showed you my reusable payment code and I still only hear excuses where are my tx that you said you can see from my followers?

Yes yes I misspoke about how I can see all your follower's transactions, when I clearly meant all transactions notifying your paynym. You knew the mistake I made and tried to catch me on this to minimize and deflect from the core issue, which is that *I can see all notification txs to your paynym.

noosphere888 🏴 2y ago

Then show me one notification tx to my paynym. Just one. Or even how many notification txs. Back up your claim.

PM8TJSWfiWT4oV3soqgy9X27FRHuMDK7Lk9mPiJTesfoxYYEyorkhTQCzk1V2a57Hdr4U4idJ6XntDK78D4EPMHgYWKg44bTUfPBDo9xfZYykixa1Hk7

Ugh. Fine. I'll do it later.

Kortik 🇦🇲 2y ago

Bull shit you CANNOT. I’ll be waiting please come back

Ah interesting claim. OK.

noosphere888 🏴 2y ago

It's facts. Quit spreading lies. Ignorant dumbass.

Err do you want to bet on this? Could give me a stronger incentive to check.

noosphere888 🏴 2y ago

yes how much? 0.1?

I'm poor, that's too much for me to wager.

How about this: if I can identify all on chain *notification* transactions you've received to your Paynym (there must be >0 as of block 778,170), you send me 0.5 XMR.

If not, I send you whatever the equivalent is in BTC.

I have 1 week to do this (until block 779,178).

The Paynm I'll check is:

PM8TJSWfiWT4oV3soqgy9X27FRHuMDK7Lk9mPiJTesfoxYYEyorkhTQCzk1V2a57Hdr4U4idJ6XntDK78D4EPMHgYWKg44bTUfPBDo9xfZYykixa1Hk7

To prove your side, you have to share 1 on chain notification transaction you've received that I didn't identify.

If you share a transaction I wasn't able to identify and I see the reason why I didn't identify it, and can prove that I am able to identify all transactions like it, then it's a push. I have 24 hours to prove this after you share this transaction.

The bet only applies to v1 and v2 Paynyms as spec'd here:

https://github.com/bitcoin/bips/blob/master/bip-0047.mediawiki#protocol

noosphere888 🏴 2y ago

Deal.

PM8TJSWfiWT4oV3soqgy9X27FRHuMDK7Lk9mPiJTesfoxYYEyorkhTQCzk1V2a57Hdr4U4idJ6XntDK78D4EPMHgYWKg44bTUfPBDo9xfZYykixa1Hk7

This payment code's notification address is 133Jwmk4VKhMHU54uLhQFmcKMr25m7C67u

It's received 1 notification transaction:

d01be9f14e6c7d99dbbeeff9c043a964d6a25ad343fdee5dbdb17cc97926f015

Question for you: let's say I'm offline disconnected from the chain. I share my payment code with you and Bob. You and Bob both send the notification transaction on chain. Is your claim that Bob wouldn't be able to identify your notification transaction?

PM8TJP7RYWNosUvkvj6zoV6QwhJLfQWc4fhVsp7ZWq1WR3HU3f4uUk2yuefEedzF97QMhcPfdphZEXyhWanh6ZgPUDVPmxjW9j51Wt2zHwgPvKVkdqxR

This payment code's notification address is 1EF3jhLtmTK2iLzQwtMWTGgABuoogS679T

It's received 4 notification transactions:

85339c4a7fb217e60811ce1caa00a9e619dd88fa553150b1cff1c5d0c3d02a2b

06a069c99e4e3f3fb07014710ec45a7d4db5929a2f7a41c2d6d3076b32e81f0c

bd0c62b4fd23d28a74e554c3f93093fab1eb6586f90f925c05b8fb37350e6c28

b9e72c22a2db111c12a74b178185f738e0a1cc6b6523288dd55035c3f8f3b531

#[3]

Kortik 🇦🇲 2y ago

Good job you can see the notification tx incoming to a PayNym. Doesn't link to subsequent payments though. Tx connects to a PayNym since they pay to the PayNym notif address. But the addresses derived from that connection can not be found out. You need to do #[5]

That’s not his paynym code.

Thank you for telling me what I clearly already know and have been saying this whole time. Did you know this was the case with Paynyms or did you just find out?

What is possible: seeing all notification txs to your paynym on chain.

Kortik 🇦🇲 2y ago

Where are these txid that is possible to see where are those notifications tx please share?

noosphere888 🏴 2y ago

Cause it's not possible. You're spreading straight up lies.

PM8TJSWfiWT4oV3soqgy9X27FRHuMDK7Lk9mPiJTesfoxYYEyorkhTQCzk1V2a57Hdr4U4idJ6XntDK78D4EPMHgYWKg44bTUfPBDo9xfZYykixa1Hk7

Here's mine. My salary gets paid out to it. How much do I earn?

Yes salary payouts where the world knows who you're employed by are a good use case for Paynyms, because the world can see the notification transaction from employer to you (unless you exchanged codes out of band, which I doubtc or unless your employer uses solid privacy techniques too), but can't identify the actual payout transactions.

Donations are not a good use case for paynyms if the sender does not want to reveal who they are donating to. Even though you cannot see on chain how much the donor gives and the donation transaction, the notification tx goes on chain linking donor to donee on chain, again requiring the donor to use other privacy techniques (not Paynyms) to sever the link.

noosphere888 🏴 2y ago

Show #[3] 's txs to his code he pasted. Or are you just full of shit?

Haha in what way am I full of shit? This is exactly how Paynyms are designed. Are you trying to say it's not?