Nostr Web Client

since pure non-custodial lightning wallets are hard, i think it would be ideal to just keep it as simple as possible:

custodial for small amounts, large chunks of sats over the custodial limit are automatically sent to the users non-custodial onchain wallet at regular intervals. No limits between these periods. This is a requirement to reduce liability on our end.

Our wallet doesn’t need to be hardcore non-custodial at every level (which isn’t really even possible). it will mainly be the touch point for people getting into bitcoin.

Getting their first sats from our lightning node into their non-custodial onchain wallet will be huge for people new to bitcoin and for non-custodial bitcoin as a whole.

nostr:note1mkakf3gaxktxtkdht7j38nrjfjdp5yupnklce8a5t34tpa96423q3g79ee

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Discussion

TKay 7mo ago

You just described nostr:npub1ru72lujfmp648n0v52f30pmzwnvf80jztr373pt7yhpevsuaf2useyag29

Which a team of talented individuals are gradually building.

Project Lead: nostr:npub1fuga6qv0mjyu4ru0r4cet7dnw0w4wz8r7k3myf72araypn0tnu7q7hpfdu

Bam ⚡️ بام 7mo ago

Unfortunately many Bitcoiners are deeply entrenched in complex setups and Lightning channels, viewing custodial solutions as a betrayal of Bitcoin's principles.

Our repo is open for contributors @jb55 we implemented Coinos and will do Blink soon: https://github.com/Bamskki/Cypher-Box

Geyser page: https://geyser.fund/project/cypherbox

Neo ⚡️ 7mo ago

🎯💯

Matt 7mo ago

Will the user be forced to have a noncustodial wallet?

Matt 7mo ago

Or is the automatic withdrawal optional?

jb55 7mo ago

yes

Matt 7mo ago

Seems like a decent tradeoff.

The only thing I would suggest is the ability of users to open an external wallet on zap IF they go full retard like me later on. Like how Amethyst will open Zeus when I zap someone. But I'm not an Apple user, so my UX preferences may not work or make sense in that environment.

jb55 7mo ago

we already support that

Matt 7mo ago

Sounds awesome then!

Broletariat 7mo ago

StartOS + Alby Hub has made self custodial lightning pretty easy to use. Clean UI and integrated liquidity providers on the home page.

someone 7mo ago

will this be built into Damus or a separate project?

jb55 7mo ago

it would have an interface in damus yeah. but it would be a standalone project

semisol 7mo ago

What about simple payment channels?

jb55 7mo ago

I would want to aggregate the onchain txs

semisol 7mo ago

That was another idea I had as well

josh 7mo ago

nostr:npub1xnf02f60r9v0e5kty33a404dm79zr7z2eepyrk5gsq3m7pwvsz2sazlpr5 does a great wallet. Y not them

jb55 7mo ago

y not them what

furio 7mo ago

They are doing your layered approach, custodial (cashu) to a point (you determine) then push you to their non-custodial setup.

Use their wallet. All of nostr should at least use this model for the small to medium amount transition.

jb55 7mo ago

Software is not magic. I can’t just “use their wallet” in damus unless they have built it specifically for this purpose.

furio 7mo ago

Ok nvm. I’m just a clueless moron.

atyh 7mo ago

maybe you dont get to decide what “all of nostr should” do.

furio 7mo ago

I guess you didn’t hear I was appointed king of nostr.

MAHDOOD 7mo ago

Please add the option to not send the sats to an onchain wallet or it'll disrupt the onboarding flow

jb55 7mo ago

not true

jb55 7mo ago

it would only happen when you are way over the custodial limit, I don't see how this affects onboarding at all

MAHDOOD 7mo ago

Oh you are suggesting that WHEN you get to that limit then you would notify them to send to an onchain wallet? That is fine then. I thought you meant that the user would put link an onchain wallet during onboarding. You could probably recommend some good self custody wallets too at that point. That should get normies away from garbage apps like trust wallet.

jb55 7mo ago

the user would get a non-custodial onchain wallet automatically, or they can override it with with their own address.

but they would be forced to have one regardless.

MAHDOOD 7mo ago

When would their seeds be generated? Because if you make them write down their seeds during onboarding, that might make them drop off.

TheLegendaryMan 7mo ago

If you build a custodial lightning wallet that makes taking sats over to on chain self custodial bitcoin wallets graceful.

Make sure that you do not have minimum withdrawl requirements.

Every solution that i have come across has this barrier to entry. Whether it be 250k sats, 50k sats, or even 25k sats. When you have limited income, or very few sats from zaps. Those minimum withdrawl requirements makes getting your sats off lightning and back onto on chain exceedingly difficult, or practically impossible.

I look forward to seeing what you develop. Let me know when it is ready for bug testing and i will help out. Take care and stay awesome.

johnny 7mo ago

Me gusta esta idea. Tener una billetera propia LN en la interfaz del cliente, que no necesite configurar el usuario normal simplemente usarla, aprender de forma orgánica sin casi darse cuenta es la mejor forma de permitir que la curva de aprendizaje sea más rápida.

El límite de la custodia debería venir por default un monto configurado hasta que el usuario decida modificarlo a su gusto.

#hola

Bam ⚡️ بام 7mo ago

If have a reliable custodial service you can create an OAuth login API and the rest of the features you want and we can integrate your wallet into Cypher Box. It supports self-custodial withdrawals and top-ups to built-in hot and cold wallets.

jb55 7mo ago

i'm at my limit and relying on third parties

Bam ⚡️ بام 7mo ago

This is the problem in bitcoin. We need more reliable custodians, not less. This whole space is fighting over stupid shit that nobody gives a f about while discouraging individuals and businesses to run custodial services with redemption capabilities.

Rizful.com 7mo ago

One more thing. If you are going to build your own wallet, you're going to need to choose an implementation -- LDK, LND, or CLN, basically, unless you want to wade into the world APIs and sidechains with Breez or Strike or other centralized players. I strongly recommend you talk to as many DIFFERENT experienced practitioners in Lightning as you possibly can before you decide how you want to build it. There are a lot of opinions out there, and you'll be best hearing the widest variety possible before making a plunge.

jb55 7mo ago

I am a core-lightning dev and have the oldest running lightning node. I will be using cln.

colio 7mo ago

Karadenizli 7mo ago

Is it really that hard to self custody lightning if you just made it tied to a single LSP node? Only a single channel, don't worry about liquidity, and never close it. Still much better than custodial

Matt Corallo 7mo ago

Users get really mad once their sats are on-chain and not available for making lightning payments, sadly. But we definitely need to chat about what Spiral is up to…I think you’ll like it :)

Diyahir 7mo ago

Sounds like Mutiny wallet

hasky 6mo ago

This conversation going to make us rich asf !! Our own wallet , our own money 🤩 no tax I hope 🤞

Fotoart 6mo ago

Really sounds like the Blitz wallet made by Blake.

jb55 6mo ago

its really not