Replying to Avatar arkinox

Nostr enables the ONLY social network that has a chance at gaining mass market adoption AND has the potential to utilize POW for spam deterrence. No other clown world VC-funded ESG company will ever even consider using proof of work for anything.

One of the first arguments I always hear against POW is that raising the cost of posting a note will make it so only those with large amounts of hashpower will be able to post notes, and they will dominate the protocol with spam and psyops.

This argument doesn't make sense because if large entities will see value in expending their hashpower to spam nostr, then why aren't they spamming nostr right now while the cost to do so is absolutely free? They should be here already if it is worth their time to be, but it is not dominating nostr at all.

The fallacy is the assertion that those with great hashpower actually care to spend it spamming nostr only when it isn't free. In reality, they would rather spend that hashpower on ROI, like mining bitcoin. The ROI on spamming nostr will likely never match the ROI of spamming other social networks that have no POW cost.

When a normal user posts a dozen notes per day, the cost of adding a modest POW requirement is barely noticeable — roughly a webpage load time worth of waiting. But for a spammer, this cost becomes a material electrical expense that will reduce their capacity to spam. And with a dozen other social networks more popular than nostr, where do you think they will spend their time? Spamming the networks with zero POW costs, of course.

But, putting this POW barrier over nostr would allow legitimate users to flee to nostr for a spam- free experience while keeping spammers out. It could actually help nostr grow in its network effects.

Overall, I am shocked at how bearish people are on proof-of-work, especially bitcoiners.

PoW is essential to Bitcoin but PoW doesn't stop spam, it didn't take off when it was Hashcash and it also doesn't stop spam in Bitcoin, see inscriptions for example.

> then why aren't they spamming nostr right now while the cost to do so is absolutely free?

They are. When I turn off the Web of Trust filter in Nostur I see spam all the time, if you are not seeing it you are relying on your relays doing the filtering for you. Add relay.nostr.band and you will have spam in many replies (with WoT filter disabled).

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I think there were other more critical reasons why hashcash wasn't adopted.

Yes, there is spam on nostr now. I'm saying that if POW would be required, the amount of spam on nostr would only decrease, not increase as some have said.

You may see inscriptions as spam on the bitcoin blockchain, but they are not spam (worthless) to the people who pay substantial material costs to create them. Spam has a cost, and raising the cost via POW (or mempool fees) will reduce the amount of spam that people are capable of producing.

The cost you mention for PoW only matters for protecting the history of transactions, it is irrelevant for spam, it actually protects the history of spam as well. PoW works because someone trying to redo transactions would have to have more PoW than the cumulative PoW of all others.

There is no cumulative PoW in nostr, unless you are proposing to turn nostr into a blockchain but that sounds absurd to me.

Maybe I'm missing something so don't let me stop you, if you find a way that works I'll even implement it in Nostur, but I'm not convinced right now.

Just a coincidental anecdote, yesterday I was trying another nostr website and was wondering why the submit button was so slow, when I looked at the produced JSON I understood why when I found a nonce in there 🤷

Respectfully, this is a very narrow view of the utility of POW. Innovation requires experimentation. POW is not necessarily ONLY useful for bitcoin just because bitcoin is the only proven use case thus far.

If this is the only reason for POW, why did satoshi add POW to the genesis block?