Yeah, not sure what's so hard to understand that at this point in time Bitcoin doesn't provide all functionalities the market demands and therefore other cryptocurrencies focus on those, privacy being one of them.

From a pure monetary base point of view, of course Bitcoin maximalism is THE way to go! But, instead of fighting crypto projects that provide these market demands, it would be more wise to reach out and learn how to bring these functionalities to Bitcoin.

This is precisely why I look forward to roll-ups, zk-proofs, smart contract functionality on Bitcoin. And where does the inspiration for those come from? Ethereum, Monero etc. There's a way for everything to come 'home' to Bitcoin, to create a Bitcoin economy. But stubbornly fighting and insulting everything that isn't called Bitcoin will only delay that future.

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Amen, brother.

Nah, nobody actually cares about "smart contracts", totally unrelated nonsense. It's like hot gluing a swiss army knife to a Ferrari.

Useless features no one asked for or needed, used only as a second chance for people who wish they'd bought Bitcoin earlier and still don't understand it.

There is no second best.

weird that there are smart contracts on Bitcoin then ๐Ÿ™„

What do you consider a "smart contract" to be?

all scripting is the building blocks for SCs

a time lock is a SC

multisig is arguably a SC

any condition you can put on a spend beyond "matches this pub key" is technically a SC

Yes, nostr:nprofile1qqs0npwnpyvheqz7zuvuwvv9k460c0hyqlturds40hhfn34vufvehwcpzpmhxue69uhkummnw3ezuamfdejsz9rhwden5te0wfjkccte9ejxzmt4wvhxjmcmgqwgm already gave better examples I could have. Liquid, which seems to be an L2 that's generally accepted by Bitcoin purists because of the famous OGs involved with it, is applying smart contracts already. And they are building lending and borrowing functionality right now, which also requires smart contracts.

Liquid is not generally accepted, itโ€™s federalisticaly accepted.

Itโ€™s a bitcoin peg no different than wrapped bitcoin on ETH.

The sidechain has different consensus mechanisms and different centralized authorities making forks, its not based on proof-of-work.

Yes, probably right. But it's another example of a team trying to bring missing functionality that the market demands to Bitcoin with as little compromises as possible.

Another attempt is Rootstock, which brings smart contracts and partly solves your 'no proof-of-work' counter argument by being 60% merge-mined with Bitcoin. But it uses r-BTC with all its security bridging risks.

There's no point of morally demonizing these attempts before they are perfected. We can only learn in the process.

To each their own, there thousands of options trying to bring โ€œmissing functionalityโ€ to Bitcoin, it called crypto, bridges are fragile and bridges break, I use lightning and cashu so I canโ€™t say much.

I think the best way to say it is to just post nostr:npub12qz56plzehejkyp4waaannmnny4y4c30j8q55a3wlk49haslga2snypdx8's Bitcoin Takeover podcast and let you decide for yourself. https://www.youtube.com/live/1mLey8XsMBg

The real take-over attempt and threat for Bitcoin is keeping Bitcoin stale as an asset and have mostly centralized Bitcoin derivatives circulate in the market. This is what Michael Saylor supports currently.

In my view, decentralized finance on the Bitcoin network, Nostr, local Bitcoin economies ... everything that makes Bitcoin useful and flow, that enhances people's financial freedom, while keeping Bitcoin's secure and decentralized qualities, is what keeps the freedom future of Bitcoin alive.

Bennu is here to save Bitcoin ๐Ÿ’—

Jokes aside, a lot of great development is happening on layers outside of main chain and we're sitting at 2sat/vb.

C'mon now ๐Ÿ’—

The main take away I got from this pod hinges on everyone's reliance on Bitcoin Core, and to a smaller extent Knots. We need 100 different Libbitcoin interfaces with the network. Eric is a very knowledgeable guy and his work is invaluable. So heed the warning, SINGLE POINTS OF FAILURE are bad. Everyone looking at robust layer 2 solutions (scaling money is not a compsci reference) might want to check their Presuppositions about a robust layer 1.

Regardless there's no point in convincing people to use one money or another, the results speak way clearer and louder than roadmaps and function adds. If Bitcoin was worthless no one would waste their energy making them, or trading for them, or using them. So, that on its face isn't true. From that framework there are still a multitude of possibilities.

People can do whatever they want.

Demand is all okay, but demand โ‰  signal that it's good for Bitcoin.

Beyond good and evil.

You're stuck in a weird binary frame it seems.

My man, we are striving for financial freedom here. And I'm really tired of false Bitcoin maximalism morality.

What are you on about?

Did I grandstand on morality?

You have no idea what any of the things you're talking about entail to implement on the Bitcoin network.

Your act might work to garner likes or zaps but it's not Bitcoin maximalism that's sitting here pretending to understand what big changes to Bitcoin that you're alluding to entails.

Then watch that podcast to find out. Or just leave it be. On Nostr for likes and engagement, you must be joking ๐Ÿ˜„

Just admit you're in above your skis and move on.

I'm sharing what I learned over the years and what proved to be useful. That's it. I don't need to be Satoshi in order to use Bitcoin. Now, you can tell me that you disagree and equally move on.

We're sitting here at 2sats/vb & Bitcoin is trucking along.

Shit just this year BitAxe got some real traction in Open Source mining development.

Braiins just announced a successful Asic chip competitor to Bitmain.

Layers outside of main chain have seen massive developments.

This is all great ๐Ÿ‘.

Exactly my point, it's all quite amazing! I'm looking forward to running a BitAxe off-grid here myself etc. Now, I also applaud initiatives that help make Bitcoin be used for everyday life and move freely. Because what I experienced in Europe over the last months is that I'm less and less 'allowed' to use Bitcoin freely in a still very much alive fiat world.

It's an opinion. But we like Bitcoin to bring more freedom to human society, don't we?!

Some people came later to Bitcoin, indeed, thanks to you and your good recommendations I hope. And for them to break free from their fiat trap, to give them time to be truly creative and happy, they could use Bitcoin as collateral for fiat loans in the monetary transition and bridge time until Bitcoin likely rises in value. Now you prefer to sit in your Bitcoin castle and with your moral superiority point fingers at your fellow freedom lovers?

Many Bitcoiners, say nostr:nprofile1qqsvf646uxlreajhhsv9tms9u6w7nuzeedaqty38z69cpwyhv89ufcqpz3mhxue69uhhyetvv9ujuerpd46hxtnfduq3qamnwvaz7tmwdaehgu3wwa5kuegwt3f05 with Strike for example, also want to offer borrowing and lending with Bitcoin. This would be a centralized service though. L2s such as Rootstock and Liquid try to make it as close to decentralized as Bitcoin is. For that smart contracts are needed. This is DeFi. It's not necessarily gambling or shitcoining. It's just finance without intermediaries / banks, which every Bitcoiner will appreciate.

Projects such as nostr:npub1s7uvsn0ku29gutma9tw43m5gpwuc8y3qwapzy5pnu5jtllpgcucsyvfwc4 are offering that already, even non-KYC. It's not a fractional reserve type of loan by a centralized entity. It's a 'healthy' loan backed by your very own Bitcoin to which you keep the keys! Do you have to compromise on Bitcoin's security here and there? Yes, but you understand the risks. Does that open the door for shitcoinery on Bitcoin? Yes it does, humans do what they want to do. Bitcoin is for everybody, even shitcoin presidents. But you don't have to. You can remain Bitcoin-only and secure a loan against your BTC without a bank for your new business idea. Is it perfect? No. But it's as close to Bitcoin decentralized and secure as humanly possible at this moment. Amazing intentions by the developers to satisfy a market demand.

Now, new L2s are being developed that have the potential to be even closer to Bitcoin security, decentralization AND scalability as ever before ... roll-ups on Bitcoin (BitcoinOS, AlpenLabs etc.). We should celebrate that this is being tried, shouldn't we!? If it doesn't work and has flaws we'll surely point it out and can always go back to pure hodling. But financial freedom is being built here, a Bitcoin economy while transitioning from fiat.

I'm open to any views here, as I'm not a technical person myself. But after some careful financial freedom research over the years, this is what I gathered so far.

Bro ZK proofs were around before Satoshi...

That could be. I'm not deep in the technological origins. But as far as I learned, now it can be applied to blockchain financial use cases and help solve the dilemma of compromise between security, decentralization and scalability.

Dude there's no reason to pretend you know what you're talking about.

It's okay if you don't know but don't let people confuse you.

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