If you can't trustlessly settle back on-chain, it's not a Bitcoin layer
Discussion
ECash is a lightning layer 😉
This is 🥜
yes.
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Is there no version of ecash that uses btc base layer yet?
Where is that definition?
It's an opinion, there is not Bitcoin Webster's dictionary
Most would say a layer is an abstraction of another layer, since ecash is an abstraction of layer 2 lightning, it's a layer 3.
Where did you get "most" from?
Networking
From a networking perspevtibe this is very true, and aids confusion - The way I see protocols wrapped in protocols, ecash is a layer 3 regardless of its properties in relation to whichever protocols its wrapped under, i.e, as a Bitcoiner it matters whether I can trustlessly settle back on-chain, but from a networking and protocol perspective it's the relation between the protocols and how they intertwine that matters, i.e How can two languages interact for the same purpose, how does one carry the other.
if it isn't the definition, then everything is a layer. gold is a Bitcoin layer, the dollar, my house. literally everything.
Hope it takes off regardless
I know.. it's a token pegged to bitcoin. But it has its purpose if you know how to use it.
Ecash offers private bank accounts not trustless settlements.
Yup, it's beautiful
But not a layer
I'm not sure if looking at it that way is helpful. Most people in the world:
1) Are mathematically unable to ever use the base chain (not enough space)
2) Don't need the expensive security assurances of the base chain
3) Are not interested in that level of self-sovereignty, probably for valid reasons
4) Will not be spinning up the tech stack required for "full" self-sovereignty
...and they can still escape the curse of central banking with this "not bitcoin" - which carries like 90% of the value promise of on-chain bitcoin.
I get the "technical" point, I just think we should be mindful of our focus.
Not that I condone use of Ecash but if a token/coupon CAN be redeemed for an asset, it is a monetary layer. Layers are simply modes of liquidity that trade security for market velocity.
Layer1: Asset: most resistant to counterfiet, usually bearer locked, and subject to audit.
Layer2: Coupon/Token: more liquid, high transactability, a claim to an asset.
Layer3: Credit: instant, counterparty risk, can be issued with minimal asset veracity.
This is how money scales. If I locked up Bitcoin in a special wallet and literally handed out slips of paper as a claim to that bitcoin, that is a "Layer 2" coupon. It's probably not going to have wide adoption but, it is absolutely a valid claim to the Bitcoin.