Mathematical verification > Faith in community

If the tradeoffs are removing the core values like self custody, it is the question if "this version of Bitcoin" delivers any meaningful change for normal people (who did not buy early).

The store of value argument is not taking into account that a sudden loss of privacy, eg. KYC data leaking from a big exchange makes everyone a target immediately.

Do you want a store of value where everyone in the world knows what you have and where you live?

The other thing is fungibility. Tainted coins are already a thing, AML Bot and Chainanalysis tools are used by exchanges and merchants already.

I had a case where BTC was rejected because "it was used for gambling 5 hops ago".

It was not me - but i know who used it for that. It was completely legal gambling. But still i could not use the BTC for what i wanted.

The non-fungibility will lead to the P2P situation that we will check each others BTC with tools like AML Bot to make sure we do not get tainted coins which are worth less or in the worst case have law enforcement blaming us for something the previous owner of the BTC did.

I do not see how this will end well. There is also a talk from Adam Back about that - but somehow this is being ignored even if it is pretty obvious.

How do you see those two points?

I do not see how they lose control, they know who has it, so they come to your door and take it or put you in jail if they want it.

Cashu, Fedimint and custodial lightning are absolutely against the core values of Bitcoin. Not your keys, not your coins. Trusted third parties.

To me it seems it is going everywhere but not in the right direction.

I am a Bitcoiner since a very long time but i can not see the bright future for it anymore, it looks more and more like a tool to control us.

And as it is branded as a "store of value" now, it is easy to destroy that narrative. To me BTC lost most of its appeal which it had when it was a p2p digital currency.

bla bla bla, same old bitcoin maxi bullshit.

separate the money and the state - convert BTC to Monero.

What exactly is changing when we put our savings on a public, transparent ledger where the state has access to the KYC data?

Serious question, what will change (for the better)?

I will happily donate 21 axes and shovels to Bukele and his crew so they can start digging out the 3 Trillion in gold they claim they are sitting on.

I love about MPB that normal people learn about money, how the states exploit and control us and that its backed by nothing. That is why is supported MPB.

IMO it is time to rethink and expand the strategy. "Bitcoin only" makes us weak and vulnerable. We will not win against nation states with a monopoly on violence by saving on a public, transparent ledger.

I would really appreciate if MPB helps its students to protect their value and transaction data with a tool like Monero, or any other tool which provides similar, accessible data protection for the common guy.

"Bitcoin only" is depriving people of essential tools. Data protection is essential in finance - especially for people in the developing world where todays freedom fighter is tomorrows dictator.

Money should be a tool, not a religion.

How do you starve a beast with the monopoly on violence with a public, transparent ledger?

The great version of Bitcoin is called "Monero".

do mute lists already work?

thats the point

"Maybe you need some Monero" - Michael Saylor.

Motherfuckers arent so stupid and use a public, transparent ledger :)

Sooner or later, most bitcoin users will have to fill the same shit for their countries authorities too. Thats the magic of saving your wealth on a public, transparent ledger.

A public, transparent ledger is the best store of value -

for the ones who will take take it from you.

nostr:nevent1qvzqqqqqqypzpk9xancv89h24rme53yhl6dh0hyhwce528eu5hrrfcsgvkg3vermqyt8wumn8ghj7etyv4hzumn0wd68ytnvv9hxgtcpr4mhxue69uhkummnw3ezucnfw33k76twv4ezuum0vd5kzmp0qqsdx69gzxhvasc5q6w32enf42ngfnddt9qy8s6vc2ker5kj9h5m28qftk4a6

They cant forfeit your Monero if they do not know you have it.

Forever but not public :)

and nobody will find out.

Who bangs your sister on the toilet.

All good reasons to convert more BTC to Monero.