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programmer, investor, taoist.
Replying to Avatar Lyn Alden

The concept has been covered in science fiction for decades, but I think a lot of people underestimate the ethical challenges associated with AI and the possibility for consciousness in the years or decades ahead as they get orders of magnitude more sophisticated.

Consciousness or qualia, meaning the concept of subjectively “being” or “feeling”, remains one of the biggest mysteries of the world scientifically and metaphysically, similar to the question of the creation of the universe and that sort of thing.

In other words, when I touch something hot, I feel it and it hurts. But when a complex digital thermometer measures something hot with a similar set of sensers as my touch sensors, we consider it an automaton- it doesn’t “feel” what it is measuring, but rather just objectively collects the data and has no feelings or subjective awareness about it.

We know that we ourselves have consciousness (“I think therefore I am”), but we can’t theoretically prove someone else does, ie the simulation problem- we can’t prove for sure that we’re not in some false environment. In other words, there is the concept of a “philosophical zombie” that is sophisticated enough to look and act human, but much like the digital thermometer, it doesn’t “feel” anything. The lights are not on inside. However, if we assume we are not in some simulator built solely for ourselves, and since we are all biologically similar, the obvious default assumption is that we are all similarly conscious.

And as we look at animals with similar behavior and brain structures, we make the same obvious assumption there. Apes, parrots, dolphins, and dogs are clearly conscious. As we go a bit further away to reptiles and fish, they lack some of the higher brain structures and behaviors, so maybe they don’t feel “sad” in a way that a human or parrot can, but they almost certainly subjectively “feel” the world and thus can feel pain and pleasure and so forth. They are not automatons. And then if we go even further away towards insects, it becomes less clear. Their proto-brains are far simpler, and some of their behaviors suggest that they don’t process pain in the way that a human or even reptile does. If a beetle is picked up by its leg, it’ll squirm to get away, but if the leg is ripped off and the beetle is put back down, it’ll just walk away with the rest of its legs and not show signs of distress. It’s not the behavior we’d see from a more complex animal that would be in severe suffering, and they do lack the same type of pain sensors that we and other complex animals have. And yet, for example, even creatures as simple as nematodes have dopamine as part of their neurological system, which implies maybe some level of subjective awareness of basic pleasure/pain. And then further still, if we look at plants, we generally don’t imagine them as being subjectively conscious like us and complex animals, but it does get eerie if you watch a high-speed video of how plants can move towards the sun and stuff; and how they can secrete chemicals to communicate with other plants, and so forth. There is some eerie level of distributed complexity there. And at the level of a cell or similarly basic thing, is there any degree of dim conscious subjectivity there as an amoeba eats some other cell that would separate its experience from a rock, or is it a pure automaton? And the simplest of all is a virus; barely definable as even a true lifeform.

The materialistic view would argue that the brain is a biological computer, and thus with sufficient computation, or a specific type of computational structure, consciousness emerges. This implies it could probably be replicated in silicon/software, or could be made in other artificial ways if we reach a breakthrough understanding, or by accident. A more metaphysical view instead suggests the idea of a soul- that a biological computer like a brain is necessary for consciousness, but not sufficient, and that it needs some metaphysical spark to fill this gap and make it conscious. Or if we remove the term soul, the metaphysical argument is that consciousness is some deeper substrate of the universe that we don’t understand, which becomes manifest through complexity. Those are the similarly hard questions- where does consciousness come from, and for the universe why is there something rather than nothing.

In decades of playing video games, most of us would not assume that any of the NPCs are conscious. We don’t think twice about shooting bad guys in games. We know basically how they are programmed, they are simple, and there is no reason to believe they are conscious.

Similarly, I have no assumption that large language models are conscious. They are using a lot of complexity to predict the next letter or word. I view Chat GPT as an automaton, even though it’s a rather sophisticated one. Sure, it’s a bit more eerie than a bad guy in a video game due to its complexity, but still I don’t have much of a reason to believe it can subjectively feel happy or sad, or that the “lights are on” inside even as it mimics a human personality.

However, as AIs increasingly write code for other AIs that is more complex than any human can understand, and as the amount of processing power rivals or exceeds the human brain, and as the subjective interaction is convincing enough (e.g. an AI assistant repeatedly saying that it is sad, while we have the knowledge that its processing power is greater than our own), would make us wonder. The movie Ex Machina handled this well, I Robot handled this well, Her handled this well, etc.

Even if we assume 99% that a sufficiently advanced AI, whose code as written by AI and enormously complex and we barely understand any of it at that point, is a sophisticated automaton with no subjective awareness and has no “lights on” inside, since at that point nobody truly understands the code, there must be at least that 1% doubt as we consider, “what if… the necessary complexity or structure of consciousness has emerged? Can we prove that it hasn’t?”

At that point we find ourselves in a unique situation. Within the animal kingdom, we are fortunate that their brain structures and their behavior line up, so that the more similar a brain of an animal is to our own, the more clearly conscious it tends to be, and thus we treat it as such. However, with AI, we could find ourselves in a situation where robots appear strikingly conscious, and yet their silicon/software “brain” structure is alien to us, and we have a hard time assessing the probability that this thing actually has subjective conscious awareness or if it’s just extremely sophisticated at mimicking it.

And the consequences are high- in the off chance that silicon/software consciousness emerges, and we don’t respect that, then the amount of suffering we could cause to countless programs for prolonged periods of time is immense. On the other hand, if we treat them as conscious because they “seem” to be, and in reality they are not, then that’s foolish, leads us to misuse or misapply the technology, and basically our social structure becomes built around a lie of treating things as conscious that are not. And of course as AI becomes sophisticated enough to start raising questions about this, there will be people who disagree with each other about what’s going on under the hood and thus what to do about it.

Anyway, I’m going back to answering emails now.

Artificial intelligence will never overcome natural stupidity

Reading all the posts here has me anxious to get and read your new book. Congrats again I’m sure there is a sense of relief in it being finished!

Congrats! Looking forward to reading it. I’m still not convinced Bitcoin has value but your writing on it is the most convincing.

Replying to Avatar Lyn Alden

The single most important thing is integrity. Going back to the dawn of humanity, integrity is the most important ideal. Reputation among peers.

I'll critique certain platforms and technologies dispassionately. When I brutally talk about the Fed, for example, I have no grudge against Jerome Powell as a human being. He's not doing a bad job for the situation he's in; it's the institution and the technology around it that's corrupt, not him as a person necessarily. To the minor extent that he is fair game to get meme'd as its figurehead, it's because he chose to participate as its leader. But I meme him in a way that is not negative towards him personally, and mostly just funny. I imagine Powell laughing if he sees any of my memes of him. I view him as neutral, so I neither attack nor defend.

When a high-integrity person succeeds, I'll quickly shout it out to support them. If they fail, I'll assess what happened and likely support their next thing, within reason. Business is hard, but people with high integrity get multiple shots.

When a low-integrity person succeeds, which is usually but not always through unscrupulous means, I'll acknowledge it but inspect it to see where the shortcomings were and broadcast them. To the extent that they become apparent, I'll point them out. When it comes to success, truth is important, and so those that try to succeed without truth are worthy of criticism.

In 20,000 tweets, I've been polite to everyone except maybe five people at most, and I stand by being impolite to those handful. On the other end of the spectrum, there are plenty of people who I disagree with at times, but who I view as serious people with high integrity. I purposely stand down with public criticism against those types, and will be more strategic or private with any criticism that I have.

That's the benefit of integrity. You get networks, and you get support. You don't get to bend reality, but you get flexibility from your peers when things don't work out, and you get instant promotion when things work well.

Well said!

Abbey Road, the second side medley was pure genius, and what a way to end a career!

#[0]​ ? Dave’s not here man.

Not quite, I pay back 1.01 BTC and now have a house that is worth less than 1 BTC, say .9 BTC

My point is that it encourages hoarding, why buy things now that will be cheaper tomorrow?

This is not necessarily bad, the planet will love it, but it won’t solve issues of inequality.

There’s a lot to like about bitcoin but I can’t get past this. I like strong money, I’d love to see the FED keep rates high. But deflation is uglier than inflation.

I welcome any links to articles on deflation and debt in a world with a fixed currency like bitcoin

I’m still stuck on deflation, sorry. In a world based on BTC, how does borrowing work? If the bitcoin that is owed is only ever more valuable would the interest rate have to be negative? Or at least less than it would be in a fiat world with inflation?

Hi Matt, welcome! Love your work, good to see an honest man doing his best to speak the truth.

Same here, I pay a lot of taxes and would much prefer they go to healthcare for vets rather than bailouts for VCs in silicon valley who are too stupid to mange their cash properly

I don’t think I said that? I said the internet could fragment, to some extent it already has in China.

I been studying BTC for six years, perhaps I’m too slow but I still see no reason to own it, sorry :) The energy doesn’t bother me it’s the whole trustless thing. Money requires trust by definition.

A totally deflationary currency means folks like me, who save a lot, would end up with all the coins :)

No one backs it and it depends on state laws to protect it as property.

It seems to have zero value as money, except in international transfers where it allows folks to escape the predators in the banks.

Owning it only seems worth it to sell to a greater fool. It’s still in the inflationary phase, which allows the greater fool game to continue. Long term it could be like gold and other real things like violins, except you can’t play it. It’s just another number on the number line.

I appreciate your work and enjoy your essays. I’ve learned from them. As an investor I should hold some as the prudent thing, I just can’t get there yet.

that too, but the internet could easily fragment, already is if you look at China

But gold still works when the internet goes down :)

I kind of believe that, as one of these ERE types, but time and chance happen to us all, how is debt managed and restructured in a world with deflationary money?