At the risk of sounding harsh here and I want to preface this by saying that I in no way mean to offend anyoneā¦
What someone chooses to identify as, is their business. However, it is in no way anyone elseās responsibility to acknowledge or accommodate that.
If you have male genitalia you use the menās room regardless of what you āfeelā you identify as. Same goes for female genitalia.
I believe in personal rights. Like I should be able to identify as anything I want. I should be able to identify as an Apache helicopter if I choose to.
Suppose I look like a drop dead gorgeous woman but have male genitalia. Every time I go into a guys bathroom I get cat called, over and over and over. Should I get to go into the girls bathroom? Not my fault how I look.
I agree with your choice to have personal rights to identify with anything you want.
If you have male genitalia you use the menās room.
In life we donāt often get to have our cake and eat it to, you choose to identify as a woman there are negatives that come with it. Such as being catcalled. Nothing in life is a panacea.
This creates a caste of people who will always be subjugated. āDeal with itā? Not for that. Why canāt there be a solution that works like having a single bathroom that anyone can use? Not hard to implement that.
I think that would be a good solution. A single bathroom open to anyone that they could use privately. And not difficult to implement. (Potentially)
The rub is it costs money. People hate spending money on things they donāt personally benefit from.
This is true. And in some cases, it may be impossible. Pretend you are a small business owner of a restaurant. You are limited in what you can do by budget and physical space. So requiring compliance to such a thing could have the unintended consequence of bankrupting small business owners unable to comply.
Iāve previously been an investor in a
Few nyc restaurants. And every table you can fit in a space you need to as margins are tight.
You have the weigh personal and property rights. For NYC restaurants maybe you need to make seats wheelchair accessible. Do you side with people with disabilities or small business owners?
Hereās the thing for me: I tend to side with those who are marginalized. Iāve been marginalized before. Itās lonely in that corner, things are stacked against you. I would side with the disabled people, and try to make rules about it fair but accepting.
These are not mutually exclusive. Itās better for both if the business is able to remain open, EVEN if I (the disabled) am not able to personally attend this specific instance. My friends and neighbors will have jobs, possibly me indirectly even, and takeout will still be available to me.
More importantly, incompatibility with the state-designed plastic solution doesnāt mean that there is no other solution pursued, innovated, and implemented, dare I say probably a better one.
Agreed. Finding that balance is tough, not one size fits all. Unfortunately thereās likely someone who experiences hardships no matter what the solution. To me it should be the non-marginalized group. But thatās just me.
Well every restaurant has to be ADA compliant or you wonāt get a COA.
Personally, Iāve never felt the world owed me anything. And the harsh reality is, it doesnāt.
I have no problem with people choosing to be who they want to be. But requiring others to go along with it is a bridge too far imho.
What happens if others wonāt let you chose who you want to be? You looking different is somehow ārequiringā others to go along with it? This is a friction point.
Never worry about the others. Live your life.
Much of who you are is determined by your biology and you don't get the choice though, right?
Nature/nurture is usually 50/50. Sex is biological and gender is socially constructed. Thatās just the definition of those categories. Identity is a blend of both.
No, thatās kinda the point. Nobody can take your will from you. (see: Epictetus, etc. ancient Stoics)
You only control four things: opinion, pursuit, aversion, desire. āOr in a wordā¦ everything of your own doing.ā
Whatever the external results (which might inform the use of all of the above) you still are who you choose to be.
That doesnāt mean anything goes: that means everything BUT that one thing can and will be taken from you, even if it SHOULD be, in some sense, respected by society.
Most places (at least in my localities and experience) especially local institutions like schools and churches, already have some individual restrooms available for families (diaper-changing) and the handicapped. Implicitly this would already be available for other unique situations,
are you saying theyāre not superfluous enough, or that some whole-new fourth category should be made?
Personally Iām not. I think the existing ones you reference which are open to all should do the trick.
For oneā¦ Because as someone who has been āone of those peopleā for most of life, Iām telling you those kinds of solutions donāt work and tend to make things worse. I donāt wanna be called out, nor fit in arbitrarily. I want to make my own choices and live my own life. No matter the society or community or era of history, thereās always been a possibility of persecution* in response to my choices. Only I can make them, w the possibility of changing minds and worlds, but irregardless, keeping my wits and will about me and living virtuously.
I.e. Expect all hurt and blame from oneself. Be invincible.
For twoā¦ thatās impractical. For this specific issue, or all of the category, much less all within society.
Again, most people might be initially uncomfortable in the boys locker room.. you get over it, learn the way of things, what to avoid, where to go, etc.
If every one got a new private room for every possible discomfort, thatās all there would ever be, and thatād be a looooot of rooms.
Youāre better off, and I mean that as genuinely as possible, working through this on your own and thereby being prepared for the multitude of similar issues youāll encounter in society throughout your life.
Iām not saying there can/could never be such a thing, just that as earlier post mentioned, itās more of a niche, local, unique solution as completely necessary. And that this is the wrong reason and context to implement an absolute solution.
The āwork through itā approach is good for some but there are many (many) who donāt have the ability to do that. Itās not that they canāt, itās that theyāve got things systematically against them which is hard to fight against. There are many that need support in order to not be completely cast aside. This is why I tend to fight for the people who canāt fight for themselves. 45% of queer people have considered suicide at some point in their life. Everyone else itās 9%. Thatās _staggering_.
Thatās a rather bizarre, almost realistically-inconceivable hypothetical, but while presuming it to be true, this is yet another (if basically all) societal problem that would be solved with a better principle of private property*, than some vague unreal sense of public-ownership.
Now if š was in that scenario, I would probably do I what would and have in any other uncomfortable situation: either learn to bear it, and become a better person by it, or if necessary for practical or safety reasons, pursue the simplest alternative.
Changing in the womenās bathroom would DEEEEEFinitely not be thatā¦ in fact thatād be way more uncomfortable.
*(this is basically the point of private property. The results of your work doesnāt effect mine, your choices are separate from mine, and so on. Better incentives that way, better opportunity to avoid conflict.)
Itās a tough question and the rise of property rights has been more prevalent in modern times than personal rights used to be (civil rights/suffrage etc). Why canāt there be a single bathroom solution that anyone can use to help be a win win?
