Paid Time Off as a concept makes no sense to me. It feels pretty similar to social security and 401ks. Just give me my money, I'll invest it myself, I don't want your products.
Never had a corporate job, so there's my bias I guess. I just can't stop seeing what I call "adult safety blankets" built into corporate society. Lazy? Dumb? I can't explain it.
They just seem designed to make people FEEL better while not technically solving any of their concerns if you take literally any time to do the math.
I think netflix tried this. The take as much vacation as you want thing.
I think people actually took LESS time off iirc.
Not surprised in the slightest. I guess we're emotional animals. Assuming the same compensation was delivered in their paycheck.
I'll just save that money myself, maybe invest it MYSELF, then take more than 2 weeks off because my investment grew.
I guess it helps "force" people to take time off. I know many people that wouldn't take time off until they were forced by management, or their PTO was going to expire. Therefor losing money.
As a contractor my entire adult life, I'd happily take some paid time off. Sick leave would be good too. Zero chance, but at least I call the shots where I can afford to.
But what does a company withholding some of your paycheck every year and a schedule do for you?
They're going to fuck me regardless. Sick leave and holidays are often paid out in the corporate world too.
Guess I'm just jaded, I've burnt myself out needing a holiday trying to get back on top of things after losing a couple of years of proper productivity due to a serious life changing accident.
I hear you. Sorry to hear that, but glad your back too it!
So in this hypothetical situation where I don’t get paid time off, I get paid more right?
So then I can invest the additional money and afford to take unpaid leave?
How can you prove to yourself you are getting paid more than the contrary in this situation? The employer says you make $X and says be happy you aren’t making $Y but also have time off?
So on the flip side, the corporation just has some free money to give you for not producing anything?
How can you prove that your PTO isn't just included into your yearly cost to the company on the balance sheet (because it is)
Obviously it is baked in. But if you are suggesting to get rid of it, it is you the employer who has to sell me on the idea that I should want it the other way
Ie since we are no longer baking the PTO in, you better pay me more
This is the whole point of a salary vs an hourly employee
Then yes, that's my argument.
I get you on the 401k front but I don’t get you on PTO.
If you don’t get paid time off you are an hourly employee. People don’t like being hourly employees.
I’ve also never worked a corporate job but that is how I see it.
I'm arguing it's labels and emotions for the same outcome on paper.
Ok then. So you agree with me that if I am salary with no PTO I ought to get my salary increased.
Yeah absolutely. You cost the company the same on payroll regardless.
There are probably some intangibles. Plenty of companies beg there employees to take time off to reduce burnout. Raising productivity.
Right. A semantics game to make people feel better about taking off. Meanwhile when you don't, that's extra cash free to be invested.
Maybe
Maybe whatever days you don’t take off should be paid out yearly instead of accruing to some end date where you leave the company.
Still stand by that taking a break from work is healthy and it makes sense work incentivizes time off.
I agree, but a company witholding YOUR money, and offering BACK to you as an inventive for you to take more time off because you didn't plan to take time off is a semantics and emotions game. Often times that PTO gets paid out as a bonus and can get taxed at a higher rate.
It's also a one-sized fits a approach to, you get 2 weeks off vacation, and hope that's some healthy recovery... Maybe some need more, some less. I should be allowed to choose.
As a company why would I would I let you cost me money without producing anything?
Business's are just a big balance sheet. They have no emotion. At the end of the day they don't care. They can't care.
Many companies offer above legally required paid time off and other flexibility options to attract and retain talent (and it works). Not everyone has the same motivations as you.
Very aware of houw it works... We reach that point we were required to do it. But we found better ways of doing it. Im saying it's just a dumb semantics game that makes people feel better when they're getting the same yearly income regardless, or sometimes even worse with taxes depending on how the time gets paid out.
Ah, so now it makes sense, you're an employer. It's not about the principle at all.
I've been on both sides :) At the moment I'm neither XD
What do you mean by principle in this case?
You originally said you never had a corporate job implying you've always been a sole trader/ contractor but now you're saying you've been on both sides... Hmm.
Handled differently in taxes. I'd have much less utility, if they paid it out, as 47% would get skimmed off. That's the case with most benefits. Earned income is taxed to death.
My husband actually finds it hard to take the PTO because he has so much overtime, and then they harrass him at the end of the year and he like takes random days off, just to be rid of them. They don't allow pay-outs.
Yup, most older people I know too. Those who actually get OT
I simply mean as a concept its dumb. I understand the employer side (specifically medium to large employers $50m+ in revenue) when it starts to make sense
