There is no short-notes feed in Olas, not even any text feed, so there's no natural place where to put it 🤷‍♂️
The problem with the zapstore route is that that implies the user thinking "oh, I wonder what apps my social circle is using nowadays" which is a thought basically no one ever has.
Whereas people use their microblogging clients all the time, and just running into a particular discussion that happens to be originated from a non-microblogging context would happen very frequently and it's far more natural and contextual.
There's a massive difference between going to an app store and seeing "Vitor uses this reading app"
to seeing in my microblogging feed:
"Yes. But the question is should communities be forkeable or not. Forking communities creates freedom but destroys the value created by moderators because they can be easily copied."
That short note which happens to be in a kind:1111 draws me in 1000x more and could help me discover a whole lot more that I didn't even know existed.
I think you are trying to dump more responsibilities on kind 1s just because you saw it working on a few clients (not all kinds show it) and now you think every kind 1 should do it.
If it doesn't make sense for Olas, it shouldn't make sense on kind1s as well.
Chat clients offer 10-100x more visibility than Twitter-like clients. Should they display short notes as well just to increase visibility to Olas?
It doesn't make any sense.
Chat at the basis of it all. Yes.
Everybody want's their stuff to be the center of the world.
I am here trying to get the center of the world out of mine.
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You just repeated the argument but didn’t reply to my point; olas doesn’t have a text feed, so how could it even display text notes? I don’t get your point nor am I making this point about Olas whatsoever, this is for absolutely all the other stuff.
Again, my point is that a client that renders short notes should render short,regardless of whether the OP is a kind 1 or not.
Again, I follow you, the comment I quoted in my previous note is insightful; I would have liked to see it in my feed, but under your vision, that comment shouldn’t belong in my feed, it should just be a hint for an AppStore app to show me your avatar next to a reading app.
It’s a much less compelling, less organic experience, way higher friction for anunclear outcome to install some reader app than to just see your text comment right there with all your other text comments in my feed.
So, now every kind1 needs to render every kind of short note on Nostr? Like all of the chat kinds, issue reply kinds, torrent reply kinds, everything?
You are a product guy. You sure know that just because the technical form is "short" it doesn't mean that users want to see that text everywhere.
Products are designed on the semantics of the message not on the syntax of the data type. This notion that just because posts are short they MUST appear in all kind1 clients doesn't make any sense.
I am sure Olas displays texts notes in the Notifications. You could display it all there. Shouldn't this exact reply appear in your Olas notification?
Maybe you have another tab to see what your friends are doing with all the other kinds?
That's what kind 1 people have done by adding a Replies tab that shows replies from all other kinds. Maybe you should add that tab as well.
Again, it doesn't make any sense.
People don't want to see their Olas replies on Amethyst and vice versa.
Replies and all should stay in the originating client. But new conversations could spawn around the event being surfaced in kind 1 client. It does not need to be rendered in full - which is what I said in my original note.
I’m not saying you couldn’t render it - that’s the client’s choice and how many and what kinds of nips they wish to support
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Sure, but there are multiple ways to do that. People don't need to use kind 1s for everything to get that effect.
I am only talking about having the discovery mechanism - not about any technical implementation.
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I do, but only because Amethyst supports Highlights, the root kind.
If Amethyst didn't display the root kind, you would just see a bunch of replies without context (or needing to use another app to get context)
And that is just a terrible experience.
NIP-31!!!
Imagine if the template your app creates even generates a gorgeous card for the NIP-31 opengraph and your not-9802-supporting-client just renders that.
Context was the missing piece to make this work and NIP-31, specially with the template idea, provides all the context, and with NIP-89, you can even find how to consume the unsupported content (i.e. if it's a podcast open fountain, etc)
I think this is more or less what I had in mind
It would enable a far more interesting internet with more niche use cases
nostr:naddr1qvzqqqr4gupzp75cf0tahv5z7plpdeaws7ex52nmnwgtwfr2g3m37r844evqrr6jqy88wumn8ghj7mn0wvhxcmmv9uqpqvecd96nvar5de4nv7nhxdmkgeqfea8mz
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Sure, but why can't you do NIP-31 with Comments themselves? If the answer is NIP-31, you can just NIP-31 everything, including Comments.
hmmm, because they wouldn't be rendered? because they are a different kind? we're talking in circles but I think now on the github issue we've arrived to a conclusion
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What confuses me about this debate is why merge a microblogging client and a notification-stream client? Microblogging is a discrete thing, like long jump at the Olympics. Instagramming/Olas-ing is also a discrete thing, like high jump.
If there were a Notification-stream client, basically a client showing all activity of all people followed, with nicely rendered placeholders for context and all that, and settings for which types of events to surface, that'd be cool—but seems like that'd be a separate client altogether. Like the decathlon or the heptathlon something.
Trying to jam some or all of that functionality into a microblogging client seems to me like it'd make things real heavy and end up smothering the microblogging flame, you'd lose that special microblogging feeling.
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