cryptographic primitives
in this case, range proofs.
Discussion
Give a simpler explanation. If you want people to adopt monero or if you want bitcoin to add this to the base layer, you’re going to have to convince the nodes in a simpler way. https://video.nostr.build/95ccace291ed11b0cfa946bd3b4d6cd1ec8d33c9b38417f442ccad19110f5c46.mp4
Dude let's not pretend you or any bitcoiner combed thru a billion+ bitcoin transactions and made sure all input/outputs were good. You don't do that to all new transactions every ten minutes either.
You just run a node and pay zero attention like any Monero user
"But bro three people on the planet actually do that" So now you're trusting others to do it for you and be honest if they find it and not exploit it? What was the point of running a node then?
Yall make no sense
yup
In the beginning I’ve done that with my own transactions and looked through random ones in the mempool. After seeing it reliable, I stopped. However. I can’t do that with monero and the fact that the monero website itself claims that supply soundness is compromised in order to provide better privacy says a lot.
"I trust bitcoin because it's transparent and don't understand math"
i think we can safely disregard your opinion.
🥱 the opinion that matters most 
You can always tell when a maxi has lost all actual fact-based argument.
Because they pull out a fiat chart of relative speculative value as if it was meaningful.
If you’re going to commit logical fallacies (e.g. move the goalposts and straw man) then I’m just going to share the objective math that matters most.
I have not moved any goalposts.
Just continued to call out your obvious inconsistencies.
You are the one changing the subject, not I.
You’re a clown. The original post was about Snowden asking for more privacy on the base layer. I said that this won’t happen because a transparent blockchain allows for supply soundness. You argued something about zero proofs and other cryptographic shit. It’s irrelevant. You either disprove my claim or drop it. And since monero can’t even guarantee supply soundness with this same technology that you’d like to have on Bitcoin, then your arguments are pointless.
All that’s left for you to do is hard fork of Bitcoin with these zero proof concepts or stfu.
MAHDOOD the type of guy that praises Bitcoins decentralized ledger, then constantly posts centralized ledger price charts
MAHDOOD the type of guy that says he loves Bitcoins simple transparent auditability, but never takes advantage of it
MAHDOOD the type of guy that says things like "the market is always right" and "network effects" when referring to Bitcoin, but then tells you why it's wrong and can't explain Monero Darknet adoption
MAHDOOD the type of guy that talks about anonymity sets and hiding in large crowds, but then uses a transparent and pseudonymous blockchain
MAHDOOD the type of guy that talks about Bitcoin being permissionless digital cash, but then brings up permissioned white market transactions and CEX volume
In other words you havent made sure all Bitcoin transactions work out and that it's supply is sound
An advantage you don't take advantage of is hardly an advantage
Do you have evidence that the Bitcoin supply isn’t 21 million?
The onus is on you to prove it does because you are claiming it does (you want us to prove a negative)
This is logic 101
No actually the onus is on them to prove that their zero proof shit actually guarantees supply soundness. Since they’re proposing that Bitcoin should change the base layer.
Actual personal responsibility and self sovereignty requires effort.
Ill see if I can find a braindead explanation of rangeproofs or Pedersen commitments.
In the meantime here's the wikipedia on commitment schemes.
Effort is one thing. But
an engineering background is something totally different. Especially when others with engineering backgrounds are also not convinced
If only maxis were so demanding when it comes to auditing the gettxsetoutinfo function.... 😥
It is good to be intellectually consistent.
Yes it’s good to be intellectually consistent. Supply soundness was the tradeoff bitcoin went with and is the reason bitcoin is winning. The monero team clearly knows they have supply soundness risks. 
Nobody is arguing that napkin math isnt a sounder guarantee.
But it is intellectually inconsistent to bitch about ZK proofs when you are ALREADY trusting cryptographic primitives that are more complex.
That would be intellectually inconsistent except I never complained about zk proofs. I don’t even know what that is lmao all I’ve said so far is that I’ve seen my tx inputs and outputs balance out. I have firsthand experience of supply soundness in Bitcoin with my transactions. Anyone could also just do a simple sum of all the addresses in bitcoin at any time. I can’t do that with monero. There is no need to check every single transaction when you can just sum the total supply at any given moment.
So nostr:npub1wamvxt2tr50ghu4fdw47ksadnt0p277nv0vfhplmv0n0z3243zyq26u3l2 is not technically wrong when he says that monero zero proofs or whatever requires you to trust that it works. And you can argue that other cryptographic properties in bitcoin require trust too. And that’s correct but that trust is not built on my understanding of complex software. It’s built on time and actual firsthand experience. I understand how they work and trust it because it has earned my trust. No amount of firsthand experience can change the supply soundness flaw in monero. And average sheeple are not going to magically start giving a shit about their privacy anytime soon. So I’ll take the supply soundness and practice privacy using tools like pay join and ecash.
you're proving my point
Moving the goalposts.
Neither you nor monero devs can guarantee supply soundness. That makes monero a shitcoin HFSP 🫡
By the EXACT same logic
you cant trust ECDSA to ensure that only your private keys can spend your utxos.
But you do.
Your whole argument is just
"I trust Team Bitcoin when they say ECDSA is secure.
But I don't trust Team Monero when they say range proofs are secure.
I don't DYOR.
I don't verify.
I just follow the prevalent groupthink of the team I like."
Frankly, you're a sorryass Bitcoiner.
WRONG.
I trust that private keys work because I’ve literally used them to spend. But you keep moving the goalposts lmao prove that the monero supply is sound first.
Frankly you can HFSP 🫡
lol ok
You have no evidence your private key is the only key that can spend a utxo.
This property of bitcoin depends on the ECDSA encryption it uses being mathematically sound and the implementation being correctly coded
YOU *TRUST* THE BITCOIN COMMUNITY WHEN THEY TELL YOU THIS IS SO.
YOU ARE ALREADY RELYING ON CRYPTOGRAPHIC PRIMITIVES YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND.
YOU JUST REFUSE TO ACKNOWLEDGE IT.
Do you have any evidence that a different private key can spend my utxos? All you’re doing is talking in abstract theoretical “what ifs.” But it’s just unproductive mental masturbation.
Provide evidence that monero’s supply is sound. If you can’t, then that is the main reason why bitcoin is winning against monero. Adding zero proofs or whatever you call it to bitcoin would jeopardize supply soundness.
if you dont have the ability to actually reflect on your fundamental assumptions you are a waste of time.
point is
you demand proof from me,
but trust other "maxis."
WITHOUT understanding or DYOR on *either* of the cryptographic primitives involved.
it is intellectually inconsistent and you arent a cypherpunk or a true bitcoiner.
just a team player unwilling to make the effort of critical thinking.
have a nice day.