Vision Pro might be the most impressive computing device ever created. This will change everything.
https://developer.apple.com/wwdc23/101?time=4842
Spatial damus!?
Discussion
š±
Yes š
You could read my whole username with a device like that
I'll pass. I'm not okay with paying $3,500 bucks for it and it's just too invasive. It's just another means of expanding their surveillance network.
This is why I hate the "Cult of Apple".
Huge waste of cash that could buy Bitcoin
YES! EXACTLY! Stop supporting Apple's spy network!
people love apple and thats not going to end anytime soon.
and hereās will to give us an update on the advancement in decentralized media and how he leverages the power of m3 to make that possibleā¦ when
So, you support the expansion of their spy network? Then why do yoy support decentralization?
I donāt see the world as black and white as you do. Apples platform has wide reach, so building freedom tech on it is not a waste of time. Everything spies on us: every phone , apple or not, even when its off. Should we stop using computers and go live in the woods?
Then Bitcoin is pointless.
And I don't see life as black and white, I just think we need to work harder on creating systems that don't rely on centralized authorities.
Thought experiment: in what areas do you think centralization makes the most sense?
Good question. Let me clarify a bit on my previous comments. I didn't intend for it to sound like I am against centralization of any kind. I apologize for the lack of context. In fact, I think centralization can be a good thing in many areas and markets. The travel and medical industries are good examples of where centralization can do alot of good. It's not like people have the resources to build their own cars or airplanes or make their own medications, right? Though, centralization is clearly not necessary in all markets and fields (banking, food, education). E-commerce is certainly debatable. I have mixed feelings on that particular market. I just don't like the fact that centralized authorities are VERY RARELY held accountable for whatever transgressions they commit against people. Anyway, hope this explains everything.
Short of rooting a pixel and installing graphene, Iād argue Apple does a lot less spying than most, and gives more control and options to the user OOB.
The point is moot. I fully agree, there is no way to escape the level if tracking going on. Only choices about how easy to make it and which companies you trust to do it. I made my choice, and frankly, I very much look forward to a spatial Damus experience.
#DamusAR #AppleVision
Yes unless you are using graphene, apple has better privacy than google devices hands down. With google you are the product, so they have inventive to collect as much data on you as possible for ads. This is why I eventually switched from my android to apple.
I like apples decision to hide eye movement from apps, that would have been insanely invasive.
Agreed. And they have responded to market pressure in positive ways, backing down on the on device scanning, and implementing Advanced Data Protection. Theyve also made hiding your personal email and location accessible to millions of people who would otherwise lack either the skill or discipline to do so themselves.
They are far from perfect, but I dislike playing the boogeyman game when literally every single other manufacturer of devices that are actually useful has equal or greater problems.
I have a feeling some ppl would say with graphene yada yada they "could" do a better job. Still respect cuz most non tech ppl needed it so not blaming apple. The flower fruitstrs started talking shit cuz of black mirror and headsets. Still tho OneLove ying yang or whatevs
I believe in choice. I genuinely *want* graphene for example to succeed. I even get to bump into the real humans behind it on here.
I also donāt see the world as black and white. iPhone is a middle ground. A lot more control on privacy issues and sane defaults for the everyperson.
A world where either didnāt exist would be poorer imo.
Heck yea dude. Started it all. Used to struggle with "Cydia" to sideload apps way early like 3 or 4 lollll maybe one day I doubt it. Im too used to android thingies
I try to be very involved in it all.
Pictured: Samsung Galaxy A8, iPad Pro (M1), MacBook Pro (2019, Intel), ThinkPad P1 gen 5ā¦
These are a *few* of my motley crew I use *every single day*
I try to put my money where my mouth is, and appreciate every ecosystem for what itās great at.
Omniplatform ftw
Yup! Iāve built my own desktop environment in linux with nixos. Iām not tied to apple, just love computers in general and all the ways we can take advantage of them to improve our lives.
I feel the same way about game consoles and (ahem) crypto assets.
How has Nix been for you?
I was kinda scared off by the idea of learning a functional language to install a system. š¤£
At one point I was trying to use the nix environment under macOS.
Was natural to me since i did many years of pure functional programming. Immutable systems are so much better, Iāve never had to reinstall my nixos machine after almost 10 years now
I have been thinking about running nixos. May do this soon.
I usually run debian or debian based machines.
I also thought consciously addressing eye movement data privacy on the system level pretty significant, and doing it seriously enough to highlight it during the product introduction.
Closed source inherently depends on trust, but Apple, aside from that odd automated photo library content reporting feature they abandoned, they have earned mine patiently over decades. I have had no compareable continuous experience with products from any other conventional company, small or large.
Graphene is the way to go.
Apple and Google are essentially surveillance companies.
Apple accounts/iCloud accounts retain an impressive amount of data that would make the secret police of the 20th century blush. And this data can be seized by governments without you as a user being aware of it.
Google collects even more.
Unless you are using Advanced Data Protection, in which case Apple does not have access to the data stored in your iCloud account.
Yeah, that does protect more data for sure. Not everything, but a lot more.
I have never run into someone during an investigation using this protection. You have to opt into it, so as you can imagine, most don't.
Look, man... I like everything you've done for Damus and I respect you immensely for it. Please don't hate me for having a different opinion. I don't want that. Let's just agree to disagree on this topic.
š
I feel the distinct presence of reality distortion field
Have you watched the keynote ? The number of technical achievements to pull this off is pretty incredible.
They did not show any new use cases, and no killer features. Itās seems like just a replacement for monitors.
Yup š
Canāt sell power without control, bruh.
This aināt artificial. 
short sighted. Its a new *spatial* OS. Weāre moving from flat panel displays to 3D windowing and media. I dreamed of building something like this on linux, but you really need full hardware support and integration to pull it off.
Remember that window manager back in the early 2000ās that had some early concepts of this?
Looking Glass.
Big if true
Ah yes, spatial frogs and feet pics
Most people were on board for previous major leaps in personal computing.
I can see this being the step that bifurcates users. Increasingly people want to get off their devices and spend less time online, strapping one to your face is antithetical to that.
But it will be the future
I see both sides. I very much think we should be trying to step away from our devices way way more than we currently do.
However, if I'm using my devices (ie. work), I wouldn't say no to a bunch of huge virtual screens and environments.
In conclusion though... $3500 š¤£. I'm way too much of a pleb for that price tag.
I agree, like everything you should do it all in moderation!
Drink in moderation
Do drugs in moderation
Use devices in moderation ššš
So will Neuralink - you want the device embedded in to your head so you donāt know where you end and the internet begins?
What about your son, when he canāt keep up with his peers because theyāve got AI being fed directly in to their brains so he suddenly becomes bottom 25%. Is that the future you want?
Iām no Luddite but we are approaching new boundaries with technology which in this fiat world are likely to be net negative. Itās worth thinking through how far we want it to go.
Humans will merge with machines, itās inevitable. Its an insatiable evolutionary urge that will probably lead to our destruction or enlightenment. Who knows.
I think this is as invasive as a neuralink
Really though, this is how I see it. Im at peace with it. Life has evolved for millions of years. We will continue to. 
Maybe, but resist I will. With every fibre of my being.
There will be plenty that do. Perhaps even entire communities that do.
I hate to do Star Trek twice in a row, but they deal with that in the show. Some societies refuse transhumanism.
It will be interesting to see what it does to society, but mass adoption is inevitable imo. We will live in a cyberpunk world.
Impossible to predict, but interesting to think about.
Indeed. The sci-fi of todayā¦
We tend to overestimate what we are able to accomplish.
š
I love ya sitko, but short of FTL travel, Im not sure whatās off the table anymore.
We have computers writing books and music, I have gigabit internet on my phone (yeah, deep in a country county too š¤Æ) people with artificial limbs and organs (and weāre close to growing real ones).
Weād all be witches 100 years ago.
Will it make me live forever?
Yes, then sign me up!
Shoud read up on the work of Ray Kurzweil sometime. There are interesting things happening all the time there. The issue is if it will ever reach the common man.
Yes, and I would never deny that many of those things (medical apparatuses) have given many people a quality of life and life years they would have never had before.
But there are limits.
People donāt know what they want until they do
Iām sure lots of people will want this, have no doubt about it.
But unlike say the shift to laptops or a smartphone I donāt think itās going to be 90%+ wanting this tech
Agreed. The whole presentation felt very dystopian.
I see this as a device that will stay in your house for work or watching movies, etc. much less invasive than what phones have done to us.
My use case is similar but different. I am a desk guy. I need two monitors for my optimal coding flow. While media consumption will be awesome, I see myself using this more and more as my coding job takes me away from my desk more often, as a reliable way to have the screen real estate to work efficiently.
Either that or I finally learn Vim and do everything in tabs in Kitty.
But I know which one Iād prefer.
This is just the beginning, next, other companies will follow, since is not the same like they did before.
Absolutely everything I expected and not a thing more.
Not a criticism..itās the most high-tech device Iāve ever seen and I think they have probably nailed the basic immersive UX. Gigantic screens in the sky that know where I am looking is good enough!
The fact they reconstruct your face with ai during facetime callsā¦ so crazy. They really went and did some really hard things just for the UX. Its the details like this that makes me think this might actually work this time around. Weāll see.
Curious to see the visionOS Human Interface Guidelines, Platforms SotU said they release them later this month.
This looks interesting https://developer.apple.com/wwdc23/10076
I was expecting something along those lines but hoping to be wowed by ML powered full body scanning - so things like gestures would be recreated too. Thatāll come.
While it is definitely the most technologically impressive headset on the market it still has all the same flaws: you look like a doofus wearing it, battery life sucks, headsets are inherently isolating, what is the killer app for it? Not to mention the whole presentation felt dystopian and like an SNL skit.
I was really hoping Apple could sell me on AR/VR and they failed. I have the same opinion of this as every other headset.
An immersive coding environment with resolution good enough for text was all i needed to be sold on it.
Thatās fair. I know some people will really like it and Iām happy for them. It just doesnāt feel like a game changer like the iPod or iPhone. Feels very niche. Maybe in a few generations I will feel differently.
Wifi, cellular and Bluetooth a few millimeters away from your brain, what could possibly go wrong?
Also it feels like they looked at what Microsoft did with the HoloLens and Apple-ized it.
Plus needing prescription lenses wrecks it for people who wear glasses. Good luck getting insurance to cover them.
Yes please!
I just donāt see it. š
Itās a mixed bag. Itās clearly great for work like software development, with multiple virtual screens. IMHO, Apple should have focused the product as a work device. Perhaps they could have replaced the need for a laptop plus multiple screens.
Entertainment is mixed. Watching a movie is great if you live alone. Are families going to buy one for everybody? Nope.
Appleās demos looked awkward. Itās a like a space helmet dragging a cord with it. It looks āanchoredā.
Itās anti mobile and anti spontaneity. Youāre not going to walk around outside with it. A FaceTime call comes in. Are you going to run, find it and put it on? No.
As it stands, itās an expensive niche device. A laptop replacement would have been the killer app, in my view. Maybe some developer will create a killer app that we donāt anticipate.
The keynote showed shareplay/facetime functionality where you can answer on your phone and then switch to tvOS.
It would probably work similar to this, also shareplay for watching simultaneously on your tv and visionOS might be a thing ?
Pretty cool that Apple is finally catching up to C-mon en Kypski Shitty bum https://youtu.be/qMACOpqx_eM
nostr:npub1gcxzte5zlkncx26j68ez60fzkvtkm9e0vrwdcvsjakxf9mu9qewqlfnj5z nostr:npub1t0nyg64g5vwprva52wlcmt7fkdr07v5dr7s35raq9g0xgc0k4xcsedjgqv this thread got huge and it's dificult to read it in a structured way. Yesterday night I got headache trying to make sense of so many comments:D
It would be very nice we we could collapse/fold at any desired tree depth. Like there i could follow Arguments better.
#amethyst #nostr
Not only me, but other people too
I agree. It would be nice to have a folding structure
Given your background; whatās your take on the Vision Pro, VĆtor? Any particular insight/thought about it?
It's really cool product for a 10 year-old tech. It just feels very niche. It's closer to an iPad that some people might have and rarely use than an Apple watch that people wear every day. The perfect carry of Mixed Reality tech has always been sunglasses. If they can evolve the platform to that form factor, it will be huge.
A passable implementation is here for this thread: https://zapddit.com/n/f4e3cccc43140e18dff0058d3a1bab3a8d4879d148d58d69707c7b6e67ef9c83
There is scope of improvement though
Reckon itāll hold up to the demo vid standards? Pretty crazy to think this will be available soon. You can imagine this tech becoming so refined itāll be in a pair of glasses at some stage.
In 5-6 years, it will look less cumbersome. Then it will be as ubiquitous as apple watch. Unfortunately, it will explode marketing opportunities. Employers tracking eye attention for hourly pay?
They mention that eye tracking is hidden from apps, only the clicks are registered.
Oooff thatās tough to trust. But, I am not a techy, so I would hope that would not be abusedāI just would be able to tell. I could envision a scenario though where apps would not track eye movement, but use derivative data (i.e., response time, order of selection, etc.) to pursue further engagement.
*wouldnt