On **average**, drivers are involved in about 3 to 4 accidents throughout their driving years.
Self-driving systems will save lives.
Discussion
And they died in each one of them?
This, and roadway dividers on highways and interstates (could be made transparent so drivers can still see their natural surroundings and scenic vistas), to prevent animals from entering the roadway.
Those systems will be hacked (or abused in some way remotely). It's a risk both ways.
Everyone I talk to about self-driving vehicles says "I dont trust them". Those same people all use their phones while driving and speed constantly. It's comical.
I wont mind self driving cars for like uber rides. I wont make it my daily driver. Ill uber in one hahaha
Can you imagine a self-driving motorcycle... that'd be terrifying.
yeah ok
tell me how they're going to be secured against hostile adversaries
and how I'm going to use them privately.
I think eventually they will need to be truely autonomous agents that only communicate at sight and don't receive OTA updates mid journey.
Advanced driving assistance is not fundamentally at odds with privacy. We just have very few first-mover companies right now that need the data collection to improve their products but I see no reason why in the future all of them would remain as data hungry as they are now.
So they’re going to siphon off all this data and then just… stop? You really believe that?
No. I fear that governments will demand that. For the children or whatever. But I hope people will demand privacy and companies will figure out how to provide what's demanded.
I wouldn’t count on either. I’d rather just continue driving myself and avoid the data being captured in the first place.
It’s already becoming an issue now and no one gives a single fuck.
https://cybernews.com/privacy/volkswagen-recording-ev-movement-data-owners-exposed/
Non-self-driving cars already phone home all kinds of data. And it's worse in some countries than in others. I think in Europe, cars have to detect accidents and report their location and the manufacturers just track the location way too much.
Yes, exactly, that’s my point. It’s not going to get better, it will only get worse with self driving cars. You’ll have no go zones, curfews, and generally just less freedom as you give more control and data to the cars and the govt.
Yet the tide might turn and while insurance might be cheaper if you guarantee to remain on paved roads, for a little extra you might still get insurance without tracking.
I fear it's just so stealth that most people don't realize it's going on before politicians turned it into more and more laws.
It’s already happened. I used to work at a major insurance provider and they’re sucking up any data they can from just about any source
we can hope I suppose.
You can't even use them privately today.
Any car sufficiently intelligent to drive on its own better come with the most robust disclosures on security practices as well as open source code. No chance we should standardize them until then.
While I agree, this absolutely won’t happen. Car manufacturers are scraping TONS of data about drivers and leaving it completely unsecured. This has happened multiple times already. And this is just typical customer data they can’t secure, let alone the critical components that do the “self driving”.
https://cybernews.com/privacy/volkswagen-recording-ev-movement-data-owners-exposed/
Every car today is a surveillance machine.
Ooops. I had 3 in 2024 :/ All at walking speed. I don't remember when I had my last accident before 2024 as it's certainly not my yearly average. Guess I'm an over-achiever.
I assume people born today will never get a drivers license as insurance for self-driving will be ridiculously expensive. Also road space will cost three times more than for self-driving cars as humans need more margin for error.
By "self-driving" do you mean that you drive the car yourself?
It's a pun to use it in the "I drive myself" sense in the first sentence and in the "self-driving cars" sense in the second but I thought it was clear. Was it not?
In the future, 'self-driving' will refer to the extravagant act of driving yourself. People born today might never get a driver's license because the insurance for manual driving will be ridiculously expensive. Roads will charge triple for human drivers since we require a larger margin for error compared to autonomous cars.
If you live in urban/suburban will be mostly autonomous in 15 years. Probably only rural / off road or leisure will be self driving.
Even though this might be true, I’ll drive a manual transmission until I die.
As the saying goes "Old is Gold 🏅"
I think we need to reframe self driving. As much as I can't argue with the fact that automation will be better than humans at driving eventually, I think we really ought to ask if a future with self driving cars as our main mode of transport is one we want. And for me, that answer is no. I think cities will become less walkable, more car oriented and more dangerous for cyclists than they are now. I think there will be more cars on the road than now because instead of parking, your driverless car is supposed to go around making you money. Road noise will never end. And driverless car owners, companies will push to have dedicated roads with fences around them to prevent pedestrians from interfering with their tasks. It'll be sold under the guise of keeping us safe but its really about control. All that to say, more trains and fewer cars is the way.
for sure. idk if I trust FSD fully quite yet but more highly advanced AI-assisted driving systems would be pretty cool for accident prevention, imo.
not with **average** manual drivers on the road
No, thanks
yeah, lot of tradeoffs to consider though
I'm not interested in this garbage. I like to drive on my own and will continue to do so.
That's great and all, but I don't want to live in a world where I'm unable to drive. Driving is freedom.
I agree and i think this thread is full of strawman arguments and weird edge cases where, yes, you might have to drive yourself. Does not mean 99.9% could and should be automated.
Additionally it's an illusion that you are not being tracked already. The roads (especially highways) are loaded with cameras. It would just be slightly harder to obtain the full chain of data.
To combat this start thinking about the open source car or flashing the firmware of an existing car like you now install linux on your computer that came preinstalled with windows.
Problem is, these self driving systems will be set up to do mass surveillance and take away freedom of movement. Your car won't move if your social credit is too low or you said something offensive
I'll believe in self driving cars when they work in places like Brazil where there's no signs or wrong signs on the roads and the roads are painted all wrong.
A truck hit my car recently because there's was no stop sign, there's just a small stop written in the ground that no-one sees and you need to put half the car in the road to see if there's someone coming
wen self-driving plane?
Fuck cars