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Undead Odalisques article linked in that thread is 110% true - http://jsanilac.com/dispelling-beauty-lies

But there's not a single women I know who'd not get mad reading it...

This piece of advice from the article applies to everyone:

“Empowerment is about being able to get what you want. The more beauty you have, the easier it is to get what you want. And the better you understand beauty, the easier it is to obtain it. It's that simple.”

Absolutely. And consider that beauty is in the eye of the beholder. That is, does your counterpart like what they see?

While there are general principles that apply, having a pleasing appearance is often context specific. Doctor wearing a lab coat for example.

Use visual cues to influence your counterpart.

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Discussion

Laeserin 1y ago

Yes, she has other articles, where she goes into choosing clothing styles, hairstyles, using makeup techniques, or simply changing the way you move and the expressions you make on your face.

You can do a lot, just with styling and smiling.

Laeserin 1y ago

The general idea I got from her is that:

- most men like soft, youthful, pleasant-looking women, preferably with rounded cheeks, rosebud lips, and large eyes

- the vast majority of men prefer women in their late teens or early twenties, when they have a youthful face, but an adult body

- some women maintain that youthful face well into middle age (neoteny) and that is why they stay attractive

- most men prefer hair that isn't cropped short, oddly asymmetric, or dyed an unnatural color

- most men prefer very narrow waists (low WHR)

- most men prefer a full bosom and a full behind, and it's generally better to err toward "full" than "flat"

- most men are ambivalent about female height

- most men are ambivalent about natural hair colors, but some strongly prefer lighter colors

- most men are ambivalent about eye color, but some strongly prefer lighter colors

- men tend to prefer women who are slightly paler than they are

- individual men tend to focus on a subset of the ideal and take additional factors other than raw beauty into consideration, when selecting a partner, so almost all women have a selection of men to choose from

Lucid 1y ago

I like when they can bear my children.

Laeserin 1y ago

Well, that's essentially what she described:

What the most-fertile woman would look and act like, as opposed to the sterile "trans" ideal.

Lucid 1y ago

Maybe though. I've made large sons. Though beautiful, idk if a 5'2 115lb woman can handle my 10lb sons.

You right though.

Laeserin 1y ago

That's more a question of pelvic width, than height or weight.

Lucid 1y ago

Yes

Laeserin 1y ago

Her stuff on sexy moves and acting cutesy, etc. made me blush beet-red, but... she's right.

It's not exactly neurosurgery, what these e-Girls are offering. It's just stuff most of us wouldn't think of or that we feel ridiculous doing because we think it's silly. We've been taught to always be dignified and practical, and to only care about housekeeping and making money.

jimbocoin 🃏 1y ago

“Just be yourself” is some of the worst advice, and yet so often parroted.

If you want something from someone, be the person they want to give it up to.

Laeserin 1y ago

I thought it was interesting how she said to "lean into" what he finds attractive about you, and behave that way in an exaggerated manner. If you're sultry, act more sultry. If you're elegant, act more elegant. If you're cute, act cuter.

It had never even occured to me to think about what he found attractive. Or that there was anything about me, in particular, that he might find attractive. I was always trying to figure out why he married me, despite my being generically unnattractive.

Complete reframe. Assume he thinks you're attractive... start from there.

jimbocoin 🃏 1y ago

Another generalizable gem:

“Maximizing your attractiveness is now a moral imperative, regardless of the means employed.”

This is well established advice in industrial as well as user experience design. Beautiful products work better. People are willing to forgive a lot of buggy behavior from their Apple products because they’re pretty.

Laeserin 1y ago

And it's a form of harm-reduction.

If your lover is tempted to watch some cutesy AI girl giggle and bounce across the screen, you can do him a favor, put some pigtails and a naughty schoolgirl outfit on, go crazy with the blush, and bounce around the bedroom. 😂

And then he gets a real Happy End, so everyone wins.

Mens' revealed preferences in the digital world is information women can use to make themselves more attractive in the real world.

So, we can close the attractiveness gap with some Girl Game.

jimbocoin 🃏 1y ago

“Beauty isn't a game with rules. But if it were, "cheat to win" would be good advice. Anything less is an unforced surrender to genetic luck.”

atyh 1y ago

this idea, reasonable at first, has reached mythological levels unicorns and snake oil salesmen could only dream of.

Laeserin 1y ago

Yes, but female attractiveness has been largely unaffected by it. Oddly.

Completely backward.

Just try to convince women to ask their husbands how they should cut their hair. They be like 😱

jimbocoin 🃏 1y ago

“Men's beauty advice is sometimes hard to distinguish from sabotage.”

That’s because men want to be a source of good feelings and will try (often unsuccessfully) to say what they think will make you feel good.

It’s hard enough to make a woman happy without bringing the truth into it.

Laeserin 1y ago

Yeah.

Men also don't realize that womens' self-image doesn't always align with mens' opinions of her appearance.

Self-esteem has mostly to do with how many friends she has and how well she's been treated, and so on.

Laeserin 1y ago

This is really her main message.

That women learn what men actually like to look at, and offer that.

A radical departure from the "I dress for myself" meme that has ruled the West for decades.

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jimbocoin 🃏 1y ago

Here’s another piece of generally useful advice from the article:

“Whenever some men care about a trait others are indifferent to, the most valuable trait isn't the one that matches the median taste. It's the one that satisfies those who care.”

Taleb (disgraced as he has become in the Bitcoin community) pointed this out with respect to kosher foods. All Coke products are kosher, not because the average consumer cares, but because a few care a whole lot and everyone else is indifferent.

I think this also explains some of the prevalence of woke elements of modern cinema. Lots of people are indifferent (live and let live) but a few care a whole lot. It also happens that the few that care are over-represented in the arts.

The general lesson is that you can’t draw conclusions about median taste from the traits of goods on offer alone. Coke is kosher everywhere, but it would be a mistake to conclude that the median Coke drinker keeps kosher.

Laeserin 1y ago

Yes, that's true.

I've experienced this with some things:

being a Christian,

being intelligent,

having blue eyes.

The men who want those things are adamant about them and everyone else doesn't really mind.

Laeserin 1y ago

I always thought having a voluptuous figure was another one, but she claims it is the median taste. That surprised me. I'm still not sure if she's right, but my life makes more sense if she's right, so I'm willing to entertain the idea.

It's very difficult to figure out what men find attractive because men are always hedging their bets when you ask their opinion directly. So, her method of judging by what men do, rather than what they say, seems sound.

I can't find a single man willing to admit to liking anything over a C-cup, for instance, but this always seemed odd to me, as that's a below-average cup size. Are most breasts unappealing to most men? Doubt.

She's just like:

Ignore them. They're lying.