Why are there less than 100k Bitcoin nodes?

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Plebs talking it but not living it

What conclusion do you draw from that

Lots of NGU techs

We are early.

It's been almost 17 years

Early as fuck lol

In 500 years it will be a different story

We are at the very beginning

A lot needs to happen to get this project to the 500 year mark

I disagree 100 percent

Nothing needs to happen bro

No human action required?

Yea I mean humans use and need money

But it was very recently discovered/ invented

To my point of being extremely early

We are already doing it

Why are less people running nodes today then there were in 2017

I don’t have all the answers

That’s what the hashtag #asknostr is for

I think eventually the full nodes will be built into Wi-Fi router boxes

Actually start 9 is already doing that…

So on a long enough time scale

Probably every household that has internet will by default run a full node

This is unfortunately wrong, most people have no incentive to do that and it wouldn't provide them any value

Im done talking to you lol thanks tho

Peace

I think you're right. Moors law doesn't stop at physical hardware - if the cost of everything falls forever, then there's just no reason not to have all the important stuff.

It’s not a project lol

IMO to increase the nr of nodes we need a tech breakthrough or more urgency. Nodes on mini PCs are great but it can only scale so far due to perceived need/tech ability/the hassle of it/education. If nodes served another purpose, that would help. What I mean is - look at ASICs also serving as home heaters, driving the upswing in home mining. It's the dual purpose, to the average pleb, that makes mining scale in a new way. What dual purpose can nodes have? I have no idea. Another point: ETFs and exchanges reduce the need for ppl to verify by running their own node. So the natural forces are working against it. Perhaps if an ETF blew up and no one got their BTC, then that would create some urgency. Random thoughts...

Cost hasn't gone up significantly, my raspberry pi with 2TB external SSD is still purring and will work for another 5 years. I still don't undersand why so few people in the world get past the hurdle. ~0.001%.

$ cost isn't the issue. That's for sure.

Good things take time. 17 years isn't that long for changing the way the world exchanges.

💯

Because there is new wave of “self custody is stupid because it’s too much money now” people actively convincing people that their sovereignty should be outsourced for safety and a $1k fee.

So it's a cultural issue?

I think it’s a changed culture amongst the new entrants into Bitcoin which far outnumber the original lot of libertarian cypherpunks.

And of those only ~5,000 knots. Scary. Bitcoin is the only chance we have….

Out of 8 Billion people, why are there only 5,000 who are actively running Bitcoin Knots on a computer?

Makes you wonder about humanity. Strange.

That's what I'm getting towards. Says a lot about the democratic model as well.

Mencken had articulated pretty well why democracy doesn’t work in his opinion (below). But 5,000 out of 8 billion people given what’s at stake, and frankly the simplicity of the concept of Bitcoin (ie money needs to be scarce). Shocking.

1. People don't want freedom but safety: "The average man wants the peace of a hog in a comfortable sty."

2. Democracy INTENSIFIES groupthink: "Democratic man is quite unable to think of himself as a free individual; he must belong to a group, or shake with fear and loneliness."

3. Democracies are plutocracies; they're run by the aristocracy of money. But the plutocracy "lacks all the essential characters of a true aristocracy: a clean tradition, culture, public spirit, honesty, honor, courage—above all, courage. It is transient and lacks a goal."

4. The plutocrats lack "an aristocratic disinterestedness born of aristocratic security." He submits. He can be bullied and broken.

5. Democracies birth their intellectual apologists - Mencken calls them "pedagogues." These are not genuine thinkers; they’re "men chiefly marked by their haunting fear of losing their jobs." This describes most journalists.

6. Democracy is anti-excellence. Freud said we repress our sex drive as it’s frowned upon...but there’s nothing that democracy frowns upon more than a CLEAR proof of superiority. Democracy says "the most worthy & laudable citizen is that one who is most like all the rest."

7. Mencken explains how this era demands we repress our greatness: "A man who has throttled a bad impulse has at least some consolation in his agonies. But a man who has throttled a good one is in a bad way indeed. Yet this great Republic swarms with such men, & their sufferings are under every eye."

8. Mencken on the two worst crimes in a democracy: "There is only one sound argument for democracy, and that is the argument that it is a crime for any man to hold himself out as better than other men, and, above all, a most heinous offense for him to prove it."

9. Mencken: "The democratic politician, confronted by the dishonesty and stupidity of his master, the mob, tries to convince himself and all the rest of us that it is really full of rectitude and wisdom." To gain power in a democracy, men sacrifice their self-respect...

10. Mencken believed democracy will cancel itself out: "Democracy may be a self-limiting disease, as civilization itself seems to be. There are thumping paradoxes in its philosophy, and some of them have a suicidal smack."

Spot on. It's concerning how few have been capable of seeing these truths and I worry that we've been to complacent as Bitcoiners and have formed ideas around false premises.

That 5k doesn't include any unreachable or Tor nodes. Over 64% of nodes are reachable via Tor only. This includes most Start9/Umbrel servers. Would be nice to see some client stats on Tor nodes, even if we know Cybil attack status would be unknown.

Nevertheless, IMHO #Bitcoin is one of the most profound human inventions.THere’s nothing else with absolute scarcity in the universe. It’s the ONLY chance we have to get out of this Orwellian system we are in. And it’s under attack via. It’s weakest link. Core Devs. Yet only a few thousand people run nodes to defend us (Knots or non-Core). Out of 8 billion. What does that tell us about humanity?

You're right that estimates for the total number of Bitcoin nodes (including both reachable and unreachable ones) can sometimes hover around or exceed 100k in older data or broader counts, but current figures are lower.

According to Bitnodes, the gold standard for tracking this, there are about 24,727 reachable nodes as of October 11, 2025—these are the ones publicly visible and connectable on the peer-to-peer network. However, their estimate for the full global network, factoring in unreachable nodes (like those behind firewalls or not advertising their IP), is around 70,252 as of October 10, 2025. This total has fluctuated over time but hasn't hit 100k recently

So what's your theory? Why after 17 years are only ~70k people running Bitcoin nodes?

Money go up, easy use of exchanges. Few want to work anymore. OG Cypher punks have moved on.

Few people care about self sovereignty and privacy anymore.

Was there a time when there were more who did, and what changed?

Yes, the total number of Bitcoin nodes (including both reachable and unreachable ones) has been significantly higher in the past. Historical estimates from Bitcoin developer Luke Dashjr show a peak of 205,546 nodes in 2017, with another high of over 200,000 in January 2018. The count has trended downward since then due to factors like improved node efficiency, higher hardware requirements, and shifts in network participation.

That's very interesting, I didn't know it was ever that high. Do you see the decline and broader lack of participation as part of a larger issue?

Yes, I do see the decline in full Bitcoin node participation as symptomatic of a larger tension in the ecosystem: the ongoing trade-off between decentralization and usability. At its core, Bitcoin thrives on a distributed network of nodes validating transactions and enforcing consensus—it's the bedrock of its security and censorship resistance. When we hit those 200k+ peaks around the 2017 bull run, it felt like a golden era of grassroots adoption, with hobbyists, miners, and early enthusiasts firing up nodes on everything from Raspberry Pis to old laptops. But as the network matured, several forces conspired to thin the herd:

- Resource demands: Full nodes now require more storage (hundreds of GB for the blockchain), bandwidth, and CPU power than in 2017, pricing out casual users without beefier hardware. It's not prohibitive for the committed, but it raises the bar.

- Shift to convenience: Most people (and even institutions) now interact via light wallets, SPV (Simplified Payment Verification), or custodial services like exchanges. Why run a node when Coinbase or Electrum handles it seamlessly? This "good enough" UX is a double-edged sword—it drives mass adoption but outsources trust, potentially funneling power to a handful of big players.

- Economic incentives: Running a node doesn't pay dividends like mining or staking in other chains. It's pure altruism or ideology, and in a world of yield-chasing, that's harder to sustain.

The broader issue? It risks subtle centralization. If too few nodes are doing the heavy lifting, we're more vulnerable to coordinated attacks, regulatory pressure on key operators, or even software bugs propagating unchecked. We've seen echoes of this in events like the 2021 Taproot upgrade, where node diversity mattered for smooth rollout. That said, it's not all doom—Bitcoin's still far more decentralized than most blockchains (Ethereum's active nodes are under 10k, for comparison), and tools like pruned nodes or mobile-friendly setups are lowering barriers again. Initiatives from folks like the Bitcoin Core devs and community groups are pushing back, too.

Ultimately, it's a reminder that decentralization isn't a set-it-and-forget-it feature; it needs active nurturing. If more of us ran nodes (even lightweight ones), it'd shore up the whole system.

I agree with most of this but it's also ChatGPT, riff with me off the dome please

I know a lot of people who have bitcoin and leave it on an exchange. It is just easier for them. They have not been ripped off yet, they have not had the IRS coming after them. They don’t want to put in the work. They just want to experience what bitcoin did a long time ago… 1000% to 5000% gain very quickly. Easy/money go up is the only thing they care about. #yolo

Again agreed, which is sad. Makes me wonder how much of the culture is entirely fake and flimsy.

We'd first have to know how many Bitcoin users are out there, and categorize them into:

- non custodial users

- custodial users

Once we know this data we can probably start figuring out a few things. For example, how many non-custodial users run nodes?

Based on the UTXO set there are likely between 1-5 million self custodial Bitcoin users

How do we know this? Anyone can have as many addresses as they please

Hence the wide range.

You're right though, if you want to say that a real Bitcoiner is someone with >50% of wealth in Bitcoin it could be as low as 250k.

That poses an additional question, which is why aren't there more Bitcoin users?

I think there are various reasons for it, but mainly the fact that money, which in fact is quite a simple concept, has been made into a very esoteric subject precisely to prevent the average individual from thinking that they could have a say on any matter related to it.

Thinking deeply and independently about money does not even seem like an option for most people, hence the "orange pill" analogy.

Why do most people require established options in order to think freely and critically

Because especially when it comes to money you don't want to end up broke with all your friends and family members pointing at you as the guy who lost it all on the shiny new thing.

If it turned out that the shiny new thing were the highest instantiation of money humanity had ever seen, it still wouldn't help the average individual since they wouldn't know how to recognize it in the first place.

So in my opinion is not even the case that people need established options to think freely and critically, they need them precisely to avoid having to think. We're social animals and we feel better by being part of a group than by being right. I think it was Naval who said that groups aim at consensus while individuals aim at truth.

I agree, very unfortunately reality.

With this framework, is it then right to use authoritarian, or at least top-down coercive practices to instill good ideas and practices onto the group?

If you could guarantee to me that we could have a benevolent dictator who would never do anything wrong and only implement incredibly great ideas for the benefit of each and every member of humankind, then sure!

Can we do that?

No. But your premise is also false. A dictator shouldn't work for the benefit of each and every member of humankind, they should work on behalf of the good, honest, and productive members of their national community.

It also poses another interesting idea: if groupthink is inevitable and humans are herd-based social creatures, it is the moral duty of a strong leader to instill good onto them.

Does allowing for more autonomy simply allow for different kinds of authoritarian leaders to rule?

I'm not sure that going in this direction is fruitful since my question was really a rhetorical one.

I cannot imagine how we would be able to have any sort of institution/entity/dictator in charge that optimizes for what is morally good and ensures material abundance without ever failing.

I'd also state that this line of thought is based on a hidden premise: do you think we can, as mankind, define a set of objective values and goals to be pursued? The question of how to then pursue these is necessarily secondary

Yes, I do think there are objective values which should be pursued. What do you think of Nayib Bukele? He's a decent example of the type of leadership I'm imagining.

Don't know much about him to be honest, he seems to have done quite a few things for El Salvador as far as I know.

So yes we can have good leaders, I'm just not sure they're reliable over the long term. Best case, they get replaced over the decades and nothing ensures we get good ones again

True. It's a tough balance to strike. These thoughts stem from my desire to have my community and my country share my values and interests.

Most people don’t care

Only like 1 percent of people on earth even like bitcoin

And of that one percent not everyone can run a node

I was a node runner

But now I have no internet at my house so it’s not possible

We are still early….

I’m somewhat tech retarded. And the enemy has been attacking my life at every angle.

Who is the enemy?

Quite certain the state is targeting me.

What makes you suspect that

Multiple extortion attempts, honeypots. Stalking, harassment. Electronics hacked, to name. Few things.

We are living in a time when other people do almost everything for us. People do not even pick up their own takeout anymore much less cook for themselves.

Very strange.

I didnt even have wifi in my home until covid shutdowns forced me to get wifi so I could continue teaching. Within 6 months, I had bitcoin and set up a node. I had never purchases computer parts or downloaded software before. I just always used my University issued laptop. But I put together a raspberry pi and run raspiblitz software. I recently upgraded to a Start9 server and run a second node. I do not even understand all the things my Start9 can do, but I am learning very slowly like a fucking caveman. I have a Bitaxe miner.

If I can do these things anyone can. Ability is not the barrier to entry.

Maybe sense of responsibility? Understanding what is really at stake here?

Maybe. God bless you and thanks for sharing your experience!

Most people don't see the importance of running a node. Took me 3 years after I started running my own node

Do we actually know how many since possibly the majority are Tor hidden nodes?

Publicly reachable nodes are around 25,000 so yes TOR is accounted for

I spoke to my friend, who started buying in the last year, about this. He asked: how much money can I make with this? I think that’s a big part of the answer

My hypothesis is add a note onto every miner, like in the past, and you solve this issue

Add a node to every miner. Not note

Mining pools consolidate large numbers of mining rigs into a single node / entry point

If you can’t open the (hardware signer) PDF,

Then Buy the bitcoin ETF - nostr:npub1cj8znuztfqkvq89pl8hceph0svvvqk0qay6nydgk9uyq7fhpfsgsqwrz4u

nostr:note16wlpl4q57pwr32rxah5s7dkjwzyjsqzskhk2gkz8nms86s8crduq2nd7yj

Running a pair here 🫡

Running one is a relative priviledge and not a necessity, so no one cares to unless you are willing to.

Most people are lazy and retarded

Because it’s too expensive and/or complicated for the benefit it provides. We need $100 turnkey nodes.

It took me a while to make mine reachable from bitnodes, and I'm a technical guy. Then I installed a vpn and now my node is again unreachable 😆

I believe only a minority of running nodes are actually reachable.

They're not here for freedom.Only for number go up.

They cost.

It costs electricity, internet and needs hardware to store. Its number is going up slowly though

Why should we have more?

My understanding is that many of the nodes are not reachable

Start9 nodes - since they use Tor - do not show up as reachable

I'm not sure if anyone has an accurate estimation of nodes