If humanity has a Creator then there's no reason why that Creator can't also have a Creator. And so on...
Theologians call this issue "infinite regress" though I think it's better described as Infinite God Recursion.
Discussion
Theres no God man, we are what we are.
I think it's best to consider "God" to be the word people use to describe whatever created the universe as we know it. This entity or phenomenon may or may not be conscious, may or may not care about us, may or may not even exist.
Seems intellectually dishonest to claim certainty that such a thing does or does not exist without verifiable proof either way.
God to me seems to be the term anxious humans use to explain what they are unable to.
Rather than simply acknowledging and accepting that there’s stuff we haven’t figured out yet and maybe are incapable of comprehending altogether because of our biologically limited perception, these anxious creatures have to resort to magical thinking, aka faith.
This would be all well and good, but some smart but terrible people long ago figured out a way to exploit this anxiety by claiming to know which version of God (ie: the unknown) was the real one (or ones).
Since faith by definition means belief without evidence (or belief with only evidence the faithful can perceive - lol), it was really easy to sell people on their version of God and then get the faithful to do all manner of crazy shit in defense of their beliefs.
Such is the nature of man, sadly. We are willing to wage war, elevate rulers, and sacrifice all manner of freedoms so long as we don’t have face the unknown or admit when we are wrong.
Pathetic really.
#grownostr
#thinkdangerously
"Haven't explained yet". Ah , the old saw that "science can prove everything, it just needs enough time". Godel proved(proved) that *everything* can never be explained. Never.
You seem to be saying that because science cannot explain everything, there must be a God.
Why can’t there just be things that we don’t/can’t understand? Why are humans so unbelievably afraid of the unknown?
Are there things a dog can’t understand? Is the SHA-256 algorithm evidence for God to cats everywhere? Oh wait, God only exists for humans right?
Darn, now that I think about it, I’m not supposed to be having any of these thoughts at all. Questioning the existence of God is in itself a big no-no for the faithful correct? And, just checking, God will never provide any actual evidence for their existence since faith is all that is needed right?
I can’t imagine any flaws whatsoever with that kind of belief system.
JFC. Believe whatever fairytales you need to tell yourself to make it through your life but just know that it is entirely possible to live a happy and fulfilled life without such nonsense. By being susceptible to this kind of shit, you’re just making others rich and yourself weak.
Peace be with you.
How you know the universe have a start?Dont trust, verify. If u cant verify, is a lie.
Considering the vastness of the universe, there's likely other forms of life somewhere. Did the Creator make them too? Or does each planet with life on it have its own Creator?
Whatever begins to exist has a cause for its existence.
The universe began to exist (supposedly debatable).
Therefore, the universe has a cause for its existence.
For me, God is best expressed as a verb. God was. God is. God will.
The problem (for me) with the Kalam Cosmological argument and other similarly ‘formal logic’ style arguments, is that you end up in metaphysics pretty quickly, arguing over definitions of words like ‘exist’ or ‘cause’.
I prefer the Moral argument, or the Finely Tuned Universe.
Christopher Hitchens apparently privately admitted that the one argument which most threatened to derail his atheism, was the Fine Tuning one.
The fine-tuning argument is derailed by the multiverse: https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10701-023-00732-8
How so? That’s behind a paywall for me.
I’ve always liked panentheism as a resolution to this paradox. If God *is* everything in the universe (including humanity, rocks, atoms, thought, etc) and is also “more” than the universe (whatever that means to our human brains), then infinite regress becomes redundant/tautological, because literally everything you can think of is included in the panentheistic universe.
I recommend the Five Ways of Proving the Existence of God of Saint Thomas Aquinas. This is a philosophical answer to the question, a very old question. and about recursive questioning about creating, Saint Augustine answered this problem, God is eternal and doesn't exist the time before him, He created the time, thinking about a time before the time is impossible. please I recommend that you read and analyze these answers, the journey is very deeply and clearing.
Peace and God bless you 🙏
I was gonna recommend Aquinas as well with regard to this particular issue.
An abstract God is an empty God, that is the same to tell theres no God in reality.
Those rely on linguistics only, no empirical proof, like axiomas in mathematics.
It is impossible to explain the origin of the material world from the material world. The origin of the universe is out of the universe. only the philosophy and metaphysics can explain this, is a logical answer. you don't expect that mathematics can resolve all questions, with an equation, because this is out of mathematics scope. This is like trying to resolve a physical problem with philosophy. it doesn't make sense.
Logisticians call that an “infinite regress”. You’re using “Theologians” as a strawman argument to justify your beliefs which is a false argument.
Love your thoughts on Bitcoin though…
The term is used by plenty of folks including philosophers and metaphysicians.
I fail to see how I'm making a strawman argument. I'm not even arguing that it's a fact, just stating it's a possibility.
I sometimes think about infinite simulation recursion. If we are in a simulation, we are probably getting close to achieving the same capability.
JBP - God is whatever you put in the highest place. It's what you serve if you do good.
This is meant definitonally. It's a metaphysical worldview centered around good and evil. Two things that certainly exist.
Rejecting the metaphysics of good and evil is obviously possible, but consider the outcome before casually dispensing with a judeo-christian God.
I'd call it a loop.
humans created their gods, which apparently created humans and so on...
but that's just my uneducated take.
good evening #nostr
Is the next level creator a/b testing her creations?
Godels Incompleteness Theorum blew up the notion that science could eventually providing all the answers. He proved that this can never happen. So, where do all the atheists go after that(most worshippers of SCIENTISM have ironically never heard of Godel) ? At this point you have to move into the realm of belief or faith. If you believe in Intelligent Design by looking around you at nature, that seems to defy entropy if even locally, then statistics backs that up , pure chance can never make all of this. Darwin has a Cambrian Explosion problem as well as "something coming from nothing" problem. God is looking more and more plausible.
As nobel physicist Joseph Hoot Taylor says(paraphrase), "science does not contradict God , it reveals God"