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John Christensen
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I have been using lightning for payments for a few online services and I have to say it is so freeing to just zap a website and get a service without needing to sign up. In fact I would gladly pay a few sats to read an article every once in a while. And as cashu grows in adoption it will be even better than lightning. I just hate signing up for stuff. It is annoying. And logging in to things is a hassle. Just let me give you some value and you give me some value back. It’s as simple as cash just on the internet. I love it. It just sucks that the echo system is so small.

Yesterday, I had an interesting experience at Steak ’n Shake. I paid using Bitcoin. It’s exciting to see mainstream businesses starting to adopt this technology. But it also raises an important question: Will people actually spend Bitcoin to pay for everyday things?

Right now, Bitcoin’s primary value proposition seems to be as a store of value—a hedge against inflation and the weaknesses of fiat currency. It’s grown significantly in that role over the past few years. So for many, spending Bitcoin feels counterintuitive; why use a potentially appreciating asset to buy fast food or coffee?

That thought stayed with me today while I was at the park with my kids. I saw a group of young children running a lemonade stand—classic, simple entrepreneurship. And I started wondering: if those kids wanted to accept Bitcoin, what would that look like? Right now, it probably wouldn’t make much sense. Not enough people would be willing to pay that way. But imagine fast-forwarding a few years, when Bitcoin is more widely accepted and the dollar has lost even more of its purchasing power.

At some point, there will be a tipping point—a moment when people stop seeing Bitcoin as “the thing you hold” and start viewing it as “the thing you use.” I used to think that shift would be gradual, but the nature of exponential change suggests it might be sudden and surprising.

Those of us who are deep in this space don’t really question if this transition will happen. The real question is how it will unfold. And that’s what makes watching moments like a fast food chain accepting Lightning—or a kid’s lemonade stand considering crypto payments—so fascinating. They’re tiny glimpses into a very different future that may arrive faster than most expect.

Bought some food with Bitcoin at Steak & Shake today.

You have a lot to scroll through. 😅 to be honest I don’t want to take the time to try and find it. You have a link to the start?

I agree that those are good things. But I feel like it has already won.

I feel like as soon as we got the ETF in the US that was the tipping point.

The mixer issue still needs to be addressed though.

Replying to Jonathan hink

Earlier this year, I fell victim to a devastating cryptocurrency scam that cost me $79,000 worth of Dogecoin (DOGE). I met a scammer through a Telegram investment group—a woman named “Clara” who posed as an experienced crypto broker. She shared impressive-looking client testimonials and promised a 35% return in just seven days. Her website looked professional, and despite my initial doubts, I eventually transferred 500,000 DOGE, worth about $79,000 at the time.

For the first week, everything looked fine—the trading platform showed my balance growing steadily. But when I tried to withdraw my funds, I was told I needed to pay a $12,000 “withdrawal fee.” Clara reassured me this was standard and fully refundable, so I paid it. Unfortunately, that was just the beginning. More unexpected charges followed: a tax clearance fee, a network fee, a security deposit. Before I knew it, I had lost an additional $8,000.

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I think your recommendation is a scam.

I want to clarify what I meant when I said “it’s just not ready.” More accurately, it’s not ready for the mainstream. Most everyday users—“normies”—aren’t ready for Bitcoin payments.

It reminds me of something from about a year ago. I was watching a video from Linus Tech Tips, where Linus and his team took on a “Linux-only challenge.” For a month (or maybe longer), they ditched Windows and tried to use Linux exclusively. At the end, Linus concluded: “Linux is just not ready for the mainstream.”

That comment really annoyed me—because I use Linux every day. But then I realized: I’m a programmer. The way I use my computer is more complex than the average user. What’s easy and intuitive for me just isn’t the same for someone else.

And that’s the core of the issue with Bitcoin. Things need to be stupid simple to work at scale. Like you mentioned, custodial solutions sometimes fail—but setting up self-custody is even harder.

I remember the first time I used an L1 Bitcoin wallet—it felt simple and intuitive. I don’t think it’s hard for everyday people to understand how Bitcoin works after they’ve tried it once or twice.

The real friction comes from L2s. They’re just a bit too complex for the average user to casually figure out. That’s where custodians come in. And honestly, I think they’re doing the best they can—but the tech is still young. There’s no universal playbook for what “doing it right” even looks like yet.

Anyway, thanks again for your thoughtful reply. I appreciate the discussion.

It’s clear to me that Bitcoin payments just aren’t ready yet. I keep trying it, thinking “hey, maybe things are better now,” but each time I end up losing money. And I just can’t recommend something that loses money.

This isn’t a comment against Coinos — I know this stuff isn’t easy, and I actually admire that you’re working to bring all the L2s into one place. That’s why I like your platform. But I’ve learned my lesson, and I never keep much in any Bitcoin payment system for exactly this reason. I really hope you get it worked out.

The only Bitcoin L2 that’s never failed me is the Liquid Network. I know it’s centralized among a few companies, but it’s hard to argue with their track record. Green Wallet gets the job done. It’s not super fast, but it’s way faster than L1, and I’ve never lost a sat using Liquid — unlike Lightning and Cashu.

I want this to work desperately. That’s why I keep trying, over and over. But please be careful — I am sure you already have been thinking this but I am going to say it anyway. “trust is hard to gain and easy to lose.” I know I’m saying things you already know, but I just had to get my feelings out.

I believe you are trying to do the right thing. I also know this is probably just a freak accident and it might not even be your fault. I am not mad. I will give you another chance because that is what I would hope for if I was in your shoes.

Keep up the work you are doing and I am praying for your success.

Replying to Avatar franzap

Listening to legend cashu developer nostr:nprofile1qqs9pk20ctv9srrg9vr354p03v0rrgsqkpggh2u45va77zz4mu5p6ccpzemhxue69uhk2er9dchxummnw3ezumrpdejz7qgkwaehxw309a5xjum59ehx7um5wghxcctwvshszrnhwden5te0dehhxtnvdakz7qrxnfk on Citadel Dispatch with nostr:nprofile1qqsqfjg4mth7uwp307nng3z2em3ep2pxnljczzezg8j7dhf58ha7ejgprdmhxue69uhhyetvv9ujucnfw33k76twwpshy6ewvdhk6qg4waehxw309amk7apwdehhxarj9ecxzun50yq3yamnwvaz7tmhda6zuat50phjummwv5qxfslc, talking about cashu.me and PWAs and this triggered some thoughts.

Needless to say PWAs are an effective way of distributing applications permissionlessly, especially on iOS, but there's a few drawbacks I wanted to mention.

- Hard to install: the fact that you have multiple steps that need explanation (go to the hamburger menu, tap on install, but on iOS use Share...). As insignificant as this sounds, it's a major UX hurdle for users and why I think PWAs are not more widespread. Apple and Google know this very well.

- Harder to discover: though not needing an app store is an upside, it hurts discoverability, especially on app stores with a social layer like nostr:nprofile1qqs83nn04fezvsu89p8xg7axjwye2u67errat3dx2um725fs7qnrqlgzqtdq0

- Reliance on domain names: Not a huge problem but definitely not as sovereign as private keys

- Hard to verify releases: since you pull data and UI from a website, it's unclear when you have upgraded, impractical to sign and next to impossible to audit a particular release. Websites typically perform lots of deployments every day

I have plans for nostr:nprofile1qqs83nn04fezvsu89p8xg7axjwye2u67errat3dx2um725fs7qnrqlgzqtdq0 itself to become a PWA to distribute PWAs, too, and looking forward to find out how to minimize these problems without losing the freedom the web provides.

I would like a link to what you were listening to. I love the cashu project. I think a lot of good work is going on there.