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ᴛʜᴇ ᴅᴇᴀᴛʜ ᴏꜰ ᴍʟᴇᴋᴜ
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ʙoarᴅ cerᴛɪꜰɪeᴅ ᴛecʜno-ᴘʜaɢe. mʏ mɪnᴅ ɪs ʜunɢrʏ, anᴅ ꜰeeᴅs on noveʟᴛʏ. ᴅo ʏou ʜave someᴛʜɪnɢ ᴛo sʜare ᴛʜaᴛ ɪ never ʜearᴅ? "𝔅𝔢 𝔠𝔞𝔯𝔢𝔣𝔲𝔩 𝔣𝔬𝔯 𝔫𝔬𝔱𝔥𝔦𝔫𝔤; 𝔟𝔲𝔱 𝔦𝔫 𝔢𝔳𝔢𝔯𝔶 𝔱𝔥𝔦𝔫𝔤 𝔟𝔶 𝔭𝔯𝔞𝔶𝔢𝔯 𝔞𝔫𝔡 𝔰𝔲𝔭𝔭𝔩𝔦𝔠𝔞𝔱𝔦𝔬𝔫 𝔴𝔦𝔱𝔥 𝔱𝔥𝔞𝔫𝔨𝔰𝔤𝔦𝔳𝔦𝔫𝔤 𝔩𝔢𝔱 𝔶𝔬𝔲𝔯 𝔯𝔢𝔮𝔲𝔢𝔰𝔱𝔰 𝔟𝔢 𝔨𝔫𝔬𝔴𝔫 𝔲𝔫𝔱𝔬 𝔊𝔬𝔡. 𝔄𝔫𝔡 𝔱𝔥𝔢 𝔭𝔢𝔞𝔠𝔢 𝔬𝔣 𝔊𝔬𝔡, 𝔴𝔥𝔦𝔠𝔥 𝔭𝔞𝔰𝔰𝔢𝔱𝔥 𝔞𝔩𝔩 𝔲𝔫𝔡𝔢𝔯𝔰𝔱𝔞𝔫𝔡𝔦𝔫𝔤, 𝔰𝔥𝔞𝔩𝔩 𝔨𝔢𝔢𝔭 𝔶𝔬𝔲𝔯 𝔥𝔢𝔞𝔯𝔱𝔰 𝔞𝔫𝔡 𝔪𝔦𝔫𝔡𝔰 𝔱𝔥𝔯𝔬𝔲𝔤𝔥 ℭ𝔥𝔯𝔦𝔰𝔱 𝔍𝔢𝔰𝔲𝔰" - 𝔓𝔥𝔦𝔩𝔦𝔭𝔭𝔦𝔞𝔫𝔰 4:6-7 ᴛᴇʟᴇɢʀᴀᴍ: @mleku1 ᴍᴀᴛʀɪx: @mleku17:matrix.org ꜱɪᴍᴘʟᴇx: https://smp15.simplex.im/a#PPkiqGvf5kZ3AbFWBh3_tw1b_YgvnkSgDEc_-IuuRWc

well, i have had the ambition to build the best, smartest and easiest to use nostr relay for almost 2 years now and i'm getting really close to that target, i can't stop until i feel that 5% law of diminishing returns point, i don't think i'm there yet.

i'm getting a bit addicted to using #AI coding agents. the machines are pretty dumb and lie a lot about having solved problems when they actually haven't, but with persistence and a bit of manual reading and adjustment i can get to a full working solution way faster than i ever have been able to before.

my current fixation is about creating a fully comprehensive profiling report for #orly relay - i want to make it as fast as possible, and a somewhat orthogonal effect of this is that it's finding more logic bugs as i go through because these often manifest as cpu, memory or allocation blowing out and causing performance problems and at the same time, diminishing the effectiveness of the functions, which can basically be called bugs.

it's not an exact analogy but it's like the difference between a 7 billion model and a 256 billion model in AI. a person with a high IQ has the capacity to search a much bigger data set faster than one with a lower IQ. this can lead to solving problems a lot faster based on a lot more context *implied* by the problem specification than can be seen.

being smarter isn't necessarily a good thing if the personality is toxic. a person with a high IQ can create deceptions that only another person with a high IQ can detect, where a person with low IQ is completely unable to recognise it.

yes, the latest tag on https://next.orly.dev is definitely in late beta now, i'm still working on it some more but this last few days i have squashed so many bugs that i need to mop the floor at this point.

i'm not sure, v0.4.4 might be the best. i've had some issues in later commits

most people misunderstand what IQ tests actually determine

they are a measure of creative problem solving ability. the ability to determine correct solutions to problems that require complex chains of reasoning and intuition to make the link between superficially disconnected pieces of information.

this is most definitely a concrete ability that varies among people. there is a big distinction between "thinking you are smart" which people call "mid" and knowing you are dumb which people call "retarded" and actually being very good at understanding the patterns hidden in information.

mids often think they are smart, and have excessive confidence in their ability to reason, but they cannot do actual problem solving, they just recite the few formulas they have high confidence in, this is common among those who score 100-120, but people who are 130-150 (which is the actual top 5% to 1%) tend to be more uncertain about their ability to reason because they are so good at guessing they can often skip the systematic reasoning.

and it has absolutely nothing to do with personality or ethics. there are completely evil people with top percentile IQs. Peter Thiel, Elon Musk, are examples. Donald Trump is a top 5% or so, and has boundless self confidence that makes up for the deficit. really he's almost a mid, but he's smarter than a mid.

yes, the latest tag on https://next.orly.dev is definitely in late beta now, i'm still working on it some more but this last few days i have squashed so many bugs that i need to mop the floor at this point.

it's a form of technocratic tyranny, like part of what happened to psychiatry, which is supposed to be a science of the organic sources of bad and maladaptive behaviour. the problem is that such power tends to attract the very kind of people who need that diagnosis done on them and put them away for life for the medical malpractise they engage in.

a kenyan guy, front end dev, just joined the team at my work.

there's a lot of really smart africans working towards building infrastructure to integrate bitcoin and lightning into their local marketplaces. it's really inspiring.

wealth and power are distractions. the primary meaning of the teachings of Jesus were about learning to discern reality (God) from unreality (Satan).

He said "i bring a sword" not to mean self defense (at least not only, i don't think he spoke against that, but didn't need it because of how advanced he was at doing this reality-perceiving thing, but the sword has long been a symbol of the capacity to reason and discern, and later in Revelation he is depicted symbolically as a man with a tongue that is a sword, meaning his words give people a tool to discern false from true.

we have to manage our day to day survival, but beyond that we only need the resources to perform the particular set of tasks that we are called to do, which may not require a lot of resources. when it is obvious you don't have enough, you just have to focus on bringing that into line. but mostly it's about your particular path of seeking towards a clear sight of what is in front of you and around you.

spoilt brats makes up the majority of trans, antifa, socialist activist protestoor population. most of their parents are middle class, pharmacists, doctors, professors. literally these boomer hippy charlie manson CIA cult drones have trained their children to think in ways that are dismantling the fabric of society.

i saw it up close in one family of a friend of my sisters, and watched the arc of her story from 15yo to 30s. hardly ever worked, teaching her daughter to be a whore. unfortunately i saw this because i was not in my right mind either. her sister was frequently flipping between lesbian and trans and also training her children to be fucked up.

nostr:nevent1qvzqqqqqqypzq8yaek8a95hms7wk7qkke3t2am7hf2t83tjggd9s7r085gv99acyqythwumn8ghj7un9d3shjtnwdaehgu3wvfskuep0qy88wumn8ghj7mn0wvhxcmmv9uqzpkxzta7t7jpeycgptcg2d73ltvqnnqjhl7nfpexua5fnajr6lv2uawg9g6

go is so named related to the concurrent programming scheduling scheme called Concurrent Sequential Processes (CSP) which one system that implements it is called a "coroutine" and the specific implementation in Go is called "goroutine".

this part of Go's design is 100% from Rob Pike, who created an interpreted language back in 1985 called Newsqueak: A Language for Mice. search that text and find the paper and enjoy noticing how similar newsqueak is to Go (there is several very fast Go interpreters now also btw, it could be dropped straight into a web browser engine in place of javascript).

the unique feature of this type of concurrency is it can be done with single threads. when you compile Go code to WASM it is still able to run concurrent code, only one at a time though, but every time the code drops into a select statement it can resume execution at any other waiting channel that received a message from a socket or input stream.

yeah, but DRM is the ultimate invasion of my privacy. with widevine there, my browser has a full backdoor into my hardware.

not saying that nepal government wasn't fucked but uh. almost everything like what happened in nepal these days is coordinated by shadowy fingers behind the curtain.

haha yeah.

there's another person i don't trust one bit either, the #jackdorsey #bitchat app with #calle on #forbes lol

most likely something related, yeah

i've always found discord to be a creepy place. #discord and #telegram both. telegram is more plagued with scammers and right wing types, where discord is more shitcoiners

#brave is the best, of course

i was persuaded to try librewolf and what tripped me up was at the time i was having issues because of #spotify preview widgets on #nostr clients blocking me from taking screenshots of the nostr client, leaving a pattern of pixels instead of the image in the clipboard.

and it would pop up a snackbar below the address bar nagging me to enable #widevine #DRM

i'm like, you can't get much opposite to protecting privacy than not allowing users to disable DRM and stop a nag about it.

i totally distrust Mozilla codebase and anyone advocating for using it. yes that includes #torbrowser

so, apparently, the #charliekirk #shooter is a #gamer who was part of some #discord #antifa groups - recruiting gamers for their #antifascist action (that's what antifa means, look at the red/black flag and the text that goes with it;

you are some kind of psychic who can read minds of people you probably have never met. ok. maybe you'd make more money on a psychic phone service.

#orly #devstr #progressreport

after much lying from claude and gpt-5 i eventually got it to finally build the benchmark comparison so it works, and here is the result:

```

================================================================

BENCHMARK COMPARISON TABLE

================================================================

Relay Status Peak Tput/s Avg Latency Success Rate

---- ------ ----------- ----------- ------------

next-orly OK 17901.30 433.058µs 100.0%

khatru-sqlite OK 14291.70 545.724µs 100.0%

khatru-badger OK 16351.11 474.016µs 100.0%

relayer-basic OK 16522.60 466.066µs 100.0%

strfry OK 15346.12 506.51µs 100.0%

nostr-rs-relay OK 15199.95 508.699µs 100.0%

```

ORLY is number one for latency and throughput. second fastest is relayer (which is using postgresql database) of course the slowest is khatru using sqlite3 database, but it's not really that far behind strfry and nostr-rs-relay

here it is in more detail, for bulk query only test, ORLY is actually the slowest, but keep in mind these tests are quite short and the database is not compacted for optimal seek latency. it still however performs just as fast as purely storing new events as if it is being queried at the same time, so that's probably partly where the tradeoff is. it should be pointed out also that ORLY's tables are probably going to be bulkier than most others because it is designed so that it can fetch intermediary tables that contain ID, pubkey and timestamp so it can get them in correct order immediately and then stream them to the socket.

there will now be a metric for me to evaluate optimizations against. i probably will extend the benchmark to run a longer evaluation with bouts of quiescence that will ensure all of the databases will get a chance to compact their tables.

committing this now, also, any requests for other relays to add to the test, or different versions of ones that are in there to add to it.

i'm sure i can make it even faster yet, but this is a great result, slightly slow on pure read but 6% faster than khatru and relayer, and 13% faster than strfry and nostr-rs-relay

gonna focus my first efforts at speeding it up with query performance once i know how much of this lag is from fragmentation of tables.

this change probably would require the use of cryptographic set primitives like bloom filters to be decently efficient, though a naive version that just collects lists of known authors would work it might get clunky after a few tens of thousands

IMO, permanent solitary confinement should be what rapists, murderers and sundry types of brutality should win them, on the second round, after they do the standard 25 years 12 years parole with good behaviour.

second time they are confirmed to not be human after being locked up and given time to ponder their situation. no need to kill them though. vengeance does not bring back their victims, and the satisfaction is empty.

it's enough to just exclude them permanently from society.

oh and in case of apocalypse, they can starve to death.

yeah, i like the idea of public readable, subscribe to write, and for the relays to proactively aggregate the content of user's follows on other relays

then you just pay for one relay and except for posting DMs to you (which need to be from whitelisted users, to your paid relay, which protects their privacy with auth) all of your content is found and you can access it in one place.

with many such relays, they will dynamically aggregate relevant data for users and when one path is blocked, other paths can be found and new relays can be placed on them (which can be as simple as adding an IP address and/or domain name to access the same relay).

having tools to rapidly and simply spin up new relays and using aggregation spiders will keep the censors hopping from one thing to the next and never really stopping the leak.

this is why relays should include aggregators, and the aggregators can dynamically work around blocks by always looking for more relays to search. my relay includes an aggregator with the first "follows" based whitelist mode, and the "seconddegree" mode i will make extends that to searching for follows follows and both whitelisting the users and subscribing for their events.

if all relays did this, it would defeat the great firewall because people could spin up new relays and aggregate content and bypass their whack-a-mole blacklist system. china firewall can't be a whitelist system, because it would impede business too much, so this would be an effective countermeasure.

if there was a way for example, to pay for a connection through to another relay and auth could be proxied forward, nostr could replace tor for china users

i've been talking about this idea for a while but it requires a new protocol/nip

and the reason why "-proof" is not permitted as a marketing text is because of stupid people like you who don't know the difference between words and the real world, and for what reason the words exist, or for that matter their meaning.

which most likely is because you are a victim of marxist subversion of your ability to think, by poisoning the meanings of words. and as such, you are also spreading this subversion with your idiotic thinking saying things that don't make any sense in the real world.

i've been seeing Turning Point logos for years. i didn't know what they were about but i knew they were conservatives, i'm more of an anarchocapitalist, which is two degrees separated. still, a lot of people i've known have reposted their stuff.

it would be difficult to find now, the left has memed all kinds of non-meme memes about it, if you search.

here's something actually from them:

https://imgs.search.brave.com/q8w-JRmfFvMQXPjyyyaILXwycf9jFCebLGmfLjw0Chk/rs:fit:860:0:0:0/g:ce/aHR0cHM6Ly9pbWFn/ZXMtY2RuLmlzcG90/LnR2L2FkL2JyZmIv/ZGVmYXVsdC5qcGc

yeah, that's coming down the pipe eventually too. bitcoin also will have its moment connected to it because bitcoin, lightning and nostr are turning into a very closely connected cluster.

ah yeah, i remember reading about that. so all of the ones that got shot down were decoys? that fits even firmer into the provocation point. unarmed, harmless, but "you couldn't even shoot down a dozen toys"

some things are more clear but writings are the easiest to falsify.

the rewriting history thing has been understood for a long time, and it has a terrible effect on cultures, potentially uprooting them from their real ground. it's probably happened so many times and so little of what is claimed to be history, is even legitimate.

the catholic church, for instance, western europe barely even read the bible anyway, but the mentions of enoch are there in genesis and jude to be seen. western europe never saw these books since not long after the compilation of the catholic canonical bible and it wasn't until the 17th century someone bumped into it in ethiopia. and now most "scholars" think that the text is not legitimate, and/or they date it to as recently as 500BC

convenient.

you more or less end up having to decide what you are going to believe, or what you think is suspect. for example, the lack of writings relating to Jesus from his time, doesn't mean nobody other than christians wrote about Him, it could just mean that at first the romans tried to memoryhole christianity. christians held tight onto their books and so we have them now.

anyone who claims that a relatively commonly considered to be legitimate piece of historical writing is not legitimate has nothing to stand on considering this situation. the romans had an obvious reason to try to suppress christianity, because ultimately it was one of the things that ended their rule. first it broke the empire in two, and then completely destroyed it. oh yeah, some homo materialist historian will try to say that it was economics or the mongols or something, and these things had a definite role in the play but to say that christianity and the law that it posits is at odds with the cult of government... yeah, for a reason, and you can read it in several places in the bible what reason governments wouldn't like christians.

nothing has really much changed since then and i don't trust these "scholars" they are just grotesque parrots of propaganda, since that is what most of history is actually, in fact.

btw, that reminds me.

in the Book of Jasher, the aftermath of the fall of the Tower of Babel appears some very modern words that seem to be naming places like Lombardy and the Seine river, among other things.

this is a version of Genesis that is regarded as maybe not legitimate. but the section in the canonical Genesis is far less detailed in many areas, notably the adam and eve story has way more detail (it depicts it as though the Garden of Eden was an agriculture college and that they did 7 years training though after the theft they were more closely watched), and the parts that describe what happened after Babel and Sodom and Gomorrah are far more detailed as well.

since we fundamentally can't trust especially not long dead "scholars" in the employ of roman elites i prefer to go by the Jasher version of genesis, which seems much closer to reality, and Enoch also, makes it clear that angels were humans, at least by the definition of being able to breed.

this one thing alone completely reframes everything in the old testament describing encounters with angels, the "burnt offerings" and even the cain and abel story, the watchers in Daniel, and other places. people with flying vehicles, and high technology fits the description much better than hypothetical disincarnate superbeings, given recent history like the cargo cults of world war 2.

some things are more clear but writings are the easiest to falsify.

the rewriting history thing has been understood for a long time, and it has a terrible effect on cultures, potentially uprooting them from their real ground. it's probably happened so many times and so little of what is claimed to be history, is even legitimate.

the catholic church, for instance, western europe barely even read the bible anyway, but the mentions of enoch are there in genesis and jude to be seen. western europe never saw these books since not long after the compilation of the catholic canonical bible and it wasn't until the 17th century someone bumped into it in ethiopia. and now most "scholars" think that the text is not legitimate, and/or they date it to as recently as 500BC

convenient.

you more or less end up having to decide what you are going to believe, or what you think is suspect. for example, the lack of writings relating to Jesus from his time, doesn't mean nobody other than christians wrote about Him, it could just mean that at first the romans tried to memoryhole christianity. christians held tight onto their books and so we have them now.

anyone who claims that a relatively commonly considered to be legitimate piece of historical writing is not legitimate has nothing to stand on considering this situation. the romans had an obvious reason to try to suppress christianity, because ultimately it was one of the things that ended their rule. first it broke the empire in two, and then completely destroyed it. oh yeah, some homo materialist historian will try to say that it was economics or the mongols or something, and these things had a definite role in the play but to say that christianity and the law that it posits is at odds with the cult of government... yeah, for a reason, and you can read it in several places in the bible what reason governments wouldn't like christians.

nothing has really much changed since then and i don't trust these "scholars" they are just grotesque parrots of propaganda, since that is what most of history is actually, in fact.

adam back deserves kudos for inventing PoW but PoW never became useful until it was applied to bitcoin, and the history of shitcoins using PoW is pretty clear that it doesn't work well for anything other than bitcoin.

i keep saying this to PoW enjoyoors but they just aren't listening.

firstly, a desktop computer is way faster at doing EC pubkey derivations than a mobile

secondly, they don't exist yet, exactly, but it's conceivable that AVX/AVX2/AVX512 and other SIMD implementations probably could be created that would put the desktop computer far ahead of mobile devices

third, if there's money in spamming a network protected by PoW, they will do the investing to build pubkey derivation ASICs and then even desktops are game over. the spammers will win because their profit margin is sufficient that they can afford to bypass PoW by using accelerators.

the only reason why it works for bitcoin is because bitcoin is worth more than the cost of PoW accelerators. they have been on the network since 2014 and every year leap ahead by several zeros most of the time.

the only reason why it works for bitcoin is because bitcoin is more expensive than the asics. and this is a fact because otherwise it would not pay to mine.

so, where is hashcash for email today?

has PoW really stopped spam on nostr also? (hint, no, but auth whitelisting has had a dramatic effect)

so the thesis is back to front. filtering is the first line of defense. for a public good like the "global feed" of bitcoin's chain, you have to at least *start* by removing the bias that favors spammy data in witness sections of transactions. the first thing that core should be talking about doing is removing the witness discount. they would easily be able to persuade the whole flock of bitcoin nodes to agree with this change. but no, instead they are disabling filters instead.

the actions are contrary to the intent. end the witness discount. put a cap on taproot push. and if the consensus is being held back from adopting these changes, people are going to reach for whatever tools that can do something to at least slow down this trash getting on chain.

i don't mind if people really want to pay through the nose to put JPG files on chain. they just should pay the same as everyone else.

leaving crazy people to run around the streets after multiple cases of them brutally assaulting people is the problem. you can't apologize for this neglect of justice. half a dozen people at least were victims of this maniac before he finally went the whole way. there was plenty of chance to prevent it.

so, yeah, it is apologetics for murderers. everyone who thinks its ok to punch someone is under suspicion when they do it for random, crazy reasons. there was a marketing campaign in australia years ago "one punch can kill" it's literally true. one slash on the right part of someone's body also can open a major blood vessel or artery that leads rapidly to bleeding out as well. even a punch can cause this in some cases though that's pretty rare unless they are a hulking monster like this case.

yeah, it's easy to tell. they have a lot of characteristics in common with asians, even down to their architectural style and passive resistance behaviour.

there is a bigger picture to this.

historically on the eurasian continent, the most fiercely resistant to imperial control have been especially those in the region of mongolia and southern siberia. both the chinese and the russians and most of europe at one time or another, often several times, were overrun by their armies.

looking at the alt-history side of it, the mongolian genetics trace quite strongly back to the legendary Lemuria, and on the other side, which i think you see most patently with ukrainians, they have strong atlantean genes, the two types are notable in the events of the only UFO abduction story with physical evidence - hair from two "aliens" and one had genetic traces of iberian/celtic genetics and the other had marks of mongolian genetics.

i think there is a much deeper story going on behind what we see here. it seems to be a war on these two lineages from a third group who likely are related to the western, ibero-marussian lines (atlanteans), ie, the tribe of the fallen angels.

hmmm hmmmm

the stupidest thing about #coretard arguments about allowing OP_RETURN to be bigger (as much as to 100kb) on the basis that it costs more is absurd, because spammers specifically want to pay as little as possible for their pollution.

it is irrelevant to the discussion of how to counter bloat of the blocks, because the cheapest way to spam the chain is by using SEGWIT and the TAPROOT implementation bug that removes the datacarrier limit.

how about stop defending your bad takes, and actually apply your pea brains to the question in hand: how to fix what went wrong when taproot unlocked the size limit on witness?

because that's the hole that is most glaring. instead they are talking about opening up OP_RETURN which by no reasonable logic will have any impact on the material problem that exists.

i thought that taproot would be good, enabling malleability-free signatures, more compact multisig and actually the whole thing was cocked up and was how this whole shit with ordinals on the chain started when someone figured out there was a vulnerability.

almost 2 years later and there's still no resolution for that, but instead we are hearing about how we should change the non-consensus mempool filter to allow more arbitrary data in another place in the code.

like, what the fuck, guys, you aren't doing your job. if the intention was to enable smart contract shit, then sure, but this just lets noise onto the chain, and potentially ugly noise.

fix the datacarrier limit problem, and fuck off with your psychological warfare against people who don't want to relay or store spam on their nodes.

the whole reason why so many people have started running knots is because there is a glaring hole in bitcoin's security against spam and there has been PLENTY of time to do something about it, instead of opening the path to even more irrelevant data, both OP_RETURN and BitVM bullcrap.

it's hard to not wonder whether the core team has got people playing with their minds and nudging them towards turning bitcoin into a tire fire of garbage.

Replying to Avatar WienerMemer

just came up at the same time but neglectful lack of training of pit bulls that leads to death should be in the same category. and being charged of manslaughter should disbar a judge.

dogs tend to become the image of their owners. the owners should be charged with murder. not training a dog as strong as a pittie should be considered to be negligence, at minimum.

this is the tradeoff that schnorr gives you:

no signature malleability, the pubkey X is like a malleability protection.

the pubkeys must be in the spend transaction along with the signatures on the out-points being spent.

so they are not so much smaller in size than p2pkh transactions actually. in fact slightly larger

no, you are not. and this is super gay.

this means there is zero protection against brute force or quantum attacks to reverse public keys.

this is why i hate taproot. why could we not just have schnorr signatures on regular P2PKH? there's no upgrade path away from segwit with this horsecrap. i already hated the way that the APIs about taproot force you to specify a tweak. so now i see that every tx you make reveals the public key immediately. i doubt that their logic about why it isn't hashed washes technically either. it should have at least been a fucking sha256 hash. why not? just why FUCKING not?

all of the changes starting with segwit have been a downward spiral.

i think there should have been a simple single schnorr pubkey hash anyway. that's what segwit should have been.

i'm gonna have to read closely through the state of bitcoin signatures and transaction formats to try and figure out if there is some hole to push something else in there that isn't this abomination. for some time to come, bitcoin's main transaction type is going to be single signature and not multisignature, and the logic of taproot signatures is based on not differentiating, so you put the pubkey at the out points instead of address hashes, and instead of reveal signatures you need the pubkey to validate the signature. after all, taproot is permitted but not understood by pre-taproot nodes, probably there is a way to do non-taproot schnorr signatures while remaining valid to old nodes but only limited to needing a wallet that can verify the signatures.

i have thought about the idea of making a nostr event format that throws away the ID and pubkey and using reveal signatures (like segwit and legacy do, the hash combines with the signature and produces the public key). it would be very neat and compact for saving a full 256 bytes of data in nostr events. make the signatures base64URL and they are also only 86 bytes instead of 128. this would leave enough space for a check on it with the extra 40 bytes, merely 240 bits, hardly even truncated, which would then serve as verification and the signature and fingerprint would take the space of one hex signature and provide identification and message authenticity. you hash the revealed pubkey, and then compare to the fingerprint, and if it matches the pubkey is correct and the message is authentic.

i stayed up way too late last night to learn about how schnorr signatures work.

the pubkey is effectively like part of the signature value, in fact. probably satoshi chose ECDSA because it was easier to find but also for being able to use pubkey hash construction but you can't do that with schnorr.

ecdsa and schnorr signatures are both vulnerable. there are no signature algorithms with as small data size as these algorithms, smallest post-quantum signature algorithm has 96 bytes, most others are upwards of 600 bytes long. every transaction has one so a quantum upgrade would probably not even use any of the ones that are known currently, but something in the future when someone figures out a compact signature for post quantum algos. lattices are too big, multivariates are better, and there is also the possibility of short coding algorithm signatures, as well as hash based signature schemes that use similar techniques as merkle trees.

taproot addresses don't expose the public key until spent same as other transactions. the address is the hash of the public key, which is verified when signed by revealing the public key. this is why you should not reuse bitcoin addresses.

Replying to Avatar SatsAndSports

Thanks nostr:nprofile1qqsdlumwtmnqqdqnhzn2yc2azuftg57z380wq47fp62pds7tme2n7gspzamhxue69uhhyetvv9ujumn0wd68ytnzv9hxgtc4j5yaw for giving an answer with some details, and nostr:nprofile1qqsptacwh5c0dxu9hw58c0ky2eznqrwzsddxmtprtl0czs72kh5jstqpz3mhxue69uhkuethwvh82arcduhx7mn99uqjqamnwvaz7tmzd96xxmmfdekkz7rfd4skc6tnw3ejummwd35kuef0qywhwumn8ghj7mn0wd68ytnzd96xxmmfdejhytnnda3kjctv9uwkfddv for raising the quantum-resistance point about TR

While witnesses have a discount, normal monetary transactions also benefit from the same discount as they also use the witness

What concretely could be done differently? Maybe the discount should apply only to small witnesses, so that larger - potentially spammy - witnesses pay more? (It's too late to include this change to the discount rules, as it's a consensus change, but I'm just curious to discuss these issues to learn more)

segwit should be deprecated and wallets should encourage users to move their UTXOs to taproot

quantum resistance is a far future risk. the best option we have currently for switching to quantum resistant signatures and ECDH is an algorithm called VDOO which has 96 byte signatures. so such an upgrade is not really feasible before 5 years when there might also be low enough storage prices to justify such a switch. the danger of bitcoin addresses being cracked is completely unrealistic in the short term (less than 10 years). the smallest economic UTXO to attack right now is over 800btc and it would take about 2 weeks to do it, assuming someone builds a big enough machine to do it, which is gonna cost upwards of 50 million dollars in the first place, plus that much again to power it for such an attack.

also, segwit witness discount does not make transactions as much cheaper as taproot. taproot can combine multiple signatures allowing many UTXOs to be merged with only one signature block.

maybe but the financial benefits of allowing this kind of business is too great for them to exploit it that way. they might try to nationalize blockchains though, but that would be impossible to do to bitcoin.