Nostr Web Client

Shoutout to nostr:npub1ate84ggysvau69hkw9ygkqwktak6xqtrkkzg465eva7vj37aqz4qqwmf3z and nostr:npub1yxp7j36cfqws7yj0hkfu2mx25308u4zua6ud22zglxp98ayhh96s8c399s for the idea!

here's a lot more real world data thanks to nostr:npub14a6q6xvt4wuv0wpdpfr336e4fweldtu6np3ehpw55h83xuw2h2zsgyz6rn

Telluride 11mo ago

Nobody cares about Monero

Damn LN is down bad, imagine getting this beaten by something no one cares about

MoneRogue 11mo ago

Clearly you do since you're commenting on a post about Monero.

Telluride 11mo ago

You got me!

Cant argue with that.

👊🏻🍻🧡

All I heard was “next time a Bitcoiner challenges you, challenge them to become a shitcoiner”

Ain’t gonna work bro

Or they could just create a real world bussines that is LN only and then someone else make a competitor that takes XMR, only then we have real world data of who wins. Are you in?

All you’re talking about is a marketing competition.

In the long term, XMR holders will suffers because of the overall value lost by the weaker asset. HFSP

Ok but the data I provided says the market participants are doing fine and actually profiting multiple times more with XMR, and that due to it being a preferred choice by buyers it's shown to be a stronger asset, yet you have 0 (zero) data so far

I don’t have 0 data. I just don’t feel the need to prove anything to you when I’m doing just fine over here. I wish you all the best with your marketing agenda.

Just don’t scam my friends with that unlimited supply coin

le sigh

Everyone gets it at the price they deserve

anyone can post non sequiturs.

it doesnt make it an intelligent response.

I’m not trying to out-intelligence you 😂 calm down giga brain

oh sorry

people are usually trying to have a conversation when they post a response

except maxis

🙄

I didn’t realise that you saying “le sigh” was a conversation starter. G’day to you now. ✌️

The difference is I made a point about what you said

You're just repeating maxi catchphrases 👍

Mark Camper 11mo ago

I agree with some of the critique. Yes, Bitcoin is not used for commerce as much as I would expect relative to 2013-2017 era.

But this data has a heavy selection bias. It's like pointing out that people don't pay more with USD in Europe.

Anyone can create a Monero wallet and anyone can use LN, this data shows what people voluntarily pick the most, also the shop I picked is literally called "ShopInBit" so it should be biased the other way?

Mark Camper 11mo ago

The name doesn't matter.

No offense to them, but what do they stand out with for the consumers? Average small businesses resaler accepting crypto.

Sure, it's niche, but there are dozens of these.

What do they really stand out with?

- they accept also XMR

-> hence, they attract a lot of XMR traffic.

It's like that rare candy food truck famous for selling mac and cheese ice cream, alongside other standard candies. -> customers from all over the town will line up there to enjoy the famous ice cream.

I'm happy that they accept it, more stores should. But I find these metrics having a limited use.

XMR have a smaller e-commerce universe (on clearnet). Its logic to think they should have bigger market share on those who accept them.

XMR users can shop anywhere using an instant swap exchange where they send XMR and the other end receives another coin, this is just a pattern that keeps repeating, the whole crypto and even bitcoin itself is still a niche in the clearnet unless you live in El Salvador so always that a new merchants appears the data is always similar with XMR at the top

plus more merchants would actually increase it even further since the current XMR users would have more places to shop, and new users could learn about XMR and have plenty of options to use it

I don’t understand your point about swaps. Every crypto can do it and (imo) it does not sum to the conversation.

Yes crypto’s are niche but Moreno is even more because (sadly) is restricted from a lot of ramps and commerce (BinacePay, Bitrefill.. and so on).

My point: we can not say Monero is more used because in the few market that accept both, monero users spend more there. I could use another crypto market and compare Bitcoin payments against USDT and say “see bitcoin is more used that USDT”. Maybe it’s true, maybe not. But that does not look like the best measurement.

nostr:nevent1qqst93f44acjz4vphhp8gexc5nz7tch7enpujxdpa9jxuu0e8y6e7fqpz3mhxw309ucnydewxqhrqt338g6rsd3e9upzpdly20m0m6meejsasmalp39jp6lw45w7nagxw53x8rgre60lpr5vqvzqqqqqqyl6fm2u

whats the selection bias here?

Mark Camper 11mo ago

thats not selection bias.

2Pac 11mo ago

I’d would be a lot more interesting if you could show it on a service that I’ve heard of and many bitcoiners use such as Bitrefill. It is strange though that of the 43% bitcoin payments only .4 is lightning. Seems unreasonably low and makes me question its validity especially if you are making extrapolating this to the entire ecosystem.

nostr:nevent1qvzqqqqqqypzppmnpqnkhegvaxa05lj7xa8yljl4axze5gv33u6t4m7sqp6xklf4qyv8wumn8ghj7un9d3shjtnddaehgctjvshx7un89uq3jamnwvaz7tmjv4kxz7fwwphhxar9wgh8qmrpvdjj7qpqde6vh89x7wjvcjqndtukhgt4cjhjwy4y930mqpr62ecj40jhrsvqgqmefz

coincards is on the thread since they take XMR directly, a bitrefill competitor, bitrefill takes many crypto except XMR exclusively so their volume could be driven by instant swappers, i.e. send xmr and receive another coin in the end

There's also Bisq with most volume being XMR, and the others listed below, it doesn't seem exaggerated considering the pattern of low LN % repeats

2Pac 11mo ago

See that looks more realistic to me so bitcoin (onchain + LN) still has 48-60% of payments.

inpc 11mo ago

Top tip: Buy crack with lightning and heroin with monero.

I’m undecided on military hardware tbh.

https://x.com/shopinbit/status/1889593410149032334?s=46

I am not against monero but this statement has it flaws. They talked about volume (dollar valued) instead of transactions. Which means people who has Moreno is more open to give away their coins rather than bitcoin owners.

Yes, we could argue that Moreno incentive to spend more (last year have been more stable than bitcoin). So it could be more easy to use it as MoE. Same happens with fiat vs cryptocurrencies (in general). As the same happens with people from Argentina/Venezuela who spend more their national currencies than the dollar they hold.

I don't see it as a "give away your coins" or "pick what's better to use and throw it away" like fiat, since the users in those markets are given the option of paying in any other crypto, they could be using Litecoin which is even in most mainstream exchanges and has easier access for all, and it also has "mweb" as a privacy feature, they could be using USDT on the Tron network, which is also common in those places like Argentina, so the question becomes: where is everyone getting their Monero from? and why using it exclusively?

But again if this is good or bad is indeed a different debate this is mostly because I've seen bitcoiners say LN is private because you can't tell how many payments are happening, and real world usage data show exactly that: how much it is being used for real world commerce, where money actually is worth and traded instead of being used for micro-cent tipping or sending back to yourself back and forth for no purpose

About LN against L1 BTC:

I run an e-commerce that accept both ways and yes, at least for us, L1 BTC still the most common option for payments. LN have been used only for small buys (if fees are high).

Austin 11mo ago

People spend the softer currencies and save the harder currencies. What you seem to be saying is that this altcoin (xmr) is softer than bitcoin.

When all the other currencies are hyper-inflated or traded to zero, then people will use bitcoin almost exclusively in transactions.

Nope in a free market of currencies, good money drives out bad money, so this altcoin (xmr) have shown stronger fundamentals in high threat environments, like the dark web, where bitcoin once reigned since the days of Silk Road, and has now been replaced by an altcoin called xmr and bitcoin is discouraged in its use