SWAN WAS USAID FOR BITCOIN INFLUENCERS.
Discussion
🤣🤣🤣
was?
Savage AF
I think that’s a little far. ;)
NO ONE KNOWS WHAT USAID IS
WE STACK SATS AND STAY HUMBLE
Ohhhhhhhh shiiiiittttt
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COINKITE *IS* AIDS
What’s wrong with coinkite?
Rug pulled from Open Source to not open source once they got market share.
Nothing. They make the best Bitcoin hardware. He’s just really into SeedSigner and NVK of coinkite happens to take every opportunity he can to shit all over SeedSigner, not wholly justifiably as far as I’ve gathered. There’s seemingly an ongoing enmity between coinkite and SeedSigner. NVK would tell you that you’re foolish to use a raspberry pi in a hardware wallet. This guy will tell you that NVK is a petty ass hole and coinkite’s products are overpriced shit.
It’s a whole thing.
This is a bullshit breakdown of what actually happened / inserting bias that didn't exist when this shit all went down.
You got one thing right, NVK is petty.
Most manlets are.
However the story is told, though, you’re the victim, yes?
Me, a victim?
No, people who bought it and continue to buy it under the guisse of Open Source who still don't know that is the case.
A lot of people are still surprised by this.
Aren't they still OSS, just without an F? Saying, that not being FOSS, so others wouldn't profit from their work?
No FOSS just means Free AND Open Source,
OSS = Open Source
Coldcard ≠ OSS
Coldcard = Source Viewable
https://redmonk.com/sogrady/2018/09/10/tragedy-of-the-commons-clause/
Free and open source means the software is being offered for free.
A lot of times software packages and they're inherent future releases are part of a paid for package even if it's Open Source.
Common mistake.
It's seems to be over my head. If I see a code of a product, it's viewable, source verifiable, but not OSS? If I can take the code and use it for other things, it's FOSS? But what is OSS without an F? OpenSource software is..? Must be free to use and change to be called OSS?
What is your recommendation?
if you prefer to use a fully FOSS signing device, the choices are seedsigner or Jade/Jade Plus AFAIK
Really recommending trezor and foundation over coinkite?
Both cater to shitcoiners and foundation got their start by ripping off coinkite code which to my understanding is why coinkite is no longer open source which is your entire argument against them
Foundation did not rip anyone off,
Coinkite did the same thing to trezor - it's called open source for a reason lol.
I'm recommending you use Open Source products as that is the future you wanna see and the present you want to be in.
Open Source devs find bugs in code all the time, which they did find really bad ones in Coldcard in the past.
Now you don't have that luxury because coinkite also has a reputation for not paying bounties.
For the shitcoin part,
That is highly irrelevant as Trezor is the oldest, meaning the most reviewed Bitcoin Hardware Wallet Source Code out there.
You'd be a fool to dismiss it with respect to prepackaged HWWs.
I personally am a SeedSigner maxi, if you build it yourself.
To each their own…
foundation definitely did some shady shit when they were launching and I have had a bad taste ever since. This was reinforced when they partnered with cake wallet…
I love my coinkite stuff. Also do not rely solely on them
Multi vendor multi sig setup is my way to mitigate a lot of concerns you have with coinkite products
Do you man,
Foundation isn't shady for using open source code thats just fucking ridiculous 🤣.
Trezor team had to come out publicly and show people how Coinkite took their code for Coldcard and tried to pass it off as if they wrote the code.
That really happened, you just probably weren't around at the time.
You have any info you can share on this? It was before my time.
Wasted a lot of time in the shitcoin casino from 2017 to 2020 before gaining an understanding of bitcoin during COVID
nostr:npub1qny3tkh0acurzla8x3zy4nhrjz5zd8l9sy9jys09umwng00manysew95gx nostr:npub1az9xj85cmxv8e9j9y80lvqp97crsqdu2fpu3srwthd99qfu9qsgstam8y8 thoughts?
Insane to think you just asked these two slimeballs to give you an unbiased take 🤣
Tag someone else you think I should hear from…
Why is nostr:nprofile1qqsqfjg4mth7uwp307nng3z2em3ep2pxnljczzezg8j7dhf58ha7ejgeyqy52 a slimeball?
He plays all sides with his hand in the cookie jar.
nostr:nprofile1qqswyfs20tenkwarqp6pz8z9v7fuaavd926rckt9hkak2husl9eentqu2wpzj also need to note that instead of providing evidence for your claims which I explicitly asked for you threw shade on others
I have provided evidence 100x over the years, I just don't have a Twitter account to go searching for the screenshots again.
Go look for it yourself.
Here you go man, you're welcome.
I mean your comparing apples to oranges 😂
Coinkite leveraged trezors open source code and then modified the code to create a better device with a secure element.
Meanwhile foundation took Coinkite code and created an almost identical product
Bro I'm sorry but this is disgusting and disingenuous.
I can't continue this conversation as it seems like your bias is controlling the narrative for you.
Good luck do what you want.
Come on…”disgusting and disingenuous”?
We all have biases.
Maybe your allegiances to seedsigner and nostr:nprofile1qqsw3znfr6vdnxrujezjrhlkqqjlvpcqx79ys7gcph9mkjjsy7zsgygwr32sk negative comments towards that product could be creating some biases on your side?
Bruh I literally listed multiple vendors bc I'm not biased.
When Coldcard was Open source I recommended them too.
Go use licensed products, I will not & yes your takes are not genuine.
NVK bad faith attacks seedsigner constantly. Odell does a much better job of explaining the shortcomings of seedsigner without the bad faith, but still with some bias. as someone who respects and appreciates his input, it'd be much simpler if he let his "superior products" win on their own merit, rather than attack a great FOSS project.
I agree with this criticism.
I don’t love the antics nvk uses against his competitors but also respect the products his company produces and still think they do it better than most
I would argue that nvk criticizes the hardware that seedsigner is using to build more than seedsigner itself though
nostr:nprofile1qqswyfs20tenkwarqp6pz8z9v7fuaavd926rckt9hkak2husl9eentqu2wpzj
This is the reason I have never bought a Coldcard never sat right with me that they benefited from FOSS by using Trezor code but then it’s not ok if people use their code. Hypocrisy is a big turn off.
I don’t consider it ethical to take someone else’s code (open source or closed source) to spin up a direct competitor and profit from the original’s authors work
IMO not much different than Chinese companies stealing IP/trade secrets from American companies to make cheap knock-offs
You don't believe in open source anon?
Why do you still reply to my notes?
You are an ignorant hateful scumbag. I have no interest engaging with you.
Keep blaming all of the worlds problems on Jews
This is not what happened,
You're parroting influencers and NVK.
Wait so what Coinkite did to Trezor was unethical too then right?
Waiting for evidence showing that coinkite did the same thing to trezor as what foundation did to coinkite. nostr:nprofile1qqswyfs20tenkwarqp6pz8z9v7fuaavd926rckt9hkak2husl9eentqu2wpzj isn’t providing anything though
If someone can show me some evidence that coinkite explicitly ripped off trezor I am happy to admit they got their start in an unethical manner
Again have not seen any actual evidence…
Stop waiting and go do some research of your own.
Yea honestly thought it was pretty common knowledge for anyone that’s been in the space for more than a year or two.
I don’t consider what coinkite did to trezor to be comparable to what foundation did
Coinkite created a different device with a secure element which trezor than adopted years later after throwing shade on secure elements…
Foundation created a near identical device as the cold card
A second a go you didn’t even know they used trezor code now you claim it’s not comparable because they added a secure element? So in the last 5 minutes you became an expert in what changes made it ok for coinkite and not ok for foundation?
Interesting take
🤣
Sucks I have to switch clients to see all the replies
Apologies for the delayed response.
I never claimed that coinkite didn’t leverage trezor code. I claimed I never heard that coinkite did the same thing to trezor as what foundation did to coinkite and I still stand by that statement after all these exchanges…
Look, you don't have to believe me.
Either way you're supporting a paradigm of government enforced licenses with respect to Bitcoin self custody.
Go cuck to the state with daddy NVK, each person chooses their path.
I’m honestly trying to understand your position here and learn
The Twitter screenshot didn’t do it for me and I explained my logic
I don’t give a shit about licenses and governments.
I support coinkite because they make quality products and I consider them good actors in the space
Meanwhile this exchange started with you endorsing “open source” companies like trezor and foundation which I consider bad actors
Go use licensed products,
I will not.
I personally will not use products from a company that:
- Actively tries to harm the ecosystem
- Spreads misinformation about their competitors
- Has fake discounts on their website that last forever and huge markups
- Offers products intentionally designed to turn into e-waste
They used a lot of Trezor code for cryptography etc. 
oh yeah that was it
the c/p the repos and then went back and changed the names so they weren't identical...
just kinda sleazy
It’s comical that you guys throw at coinkite for this but then endorse a company like foundation
I mean it’s fine being an open source maximalist that do not believe in people building businesses with licensing protections but don’t endorse some shady ripoff like foundation because they are “open source”
Foundation isnt "open source"
theyre Open Source.
whereas CK and nvk like to grift as if they were Open Source
but they're "open source"
its dishonest and reprehensible.
and bitcoiners should insist on a completely Foss hww if its going to considered a flagship standard product.
Again comical to me that you will endorse a company like foundation for being Open Source while ignoring how they got their start and partnerships with shitcoiners
Fun thread to engage with today. Appreciate everyone’s thoughts and opinions
but NVK copies Trezor code and makes a product
and when other people do the same to him,
he changes the license and starts calling them commies 🤡
tell me you dont understand open source software without telling me...
Rules for thee
Not for me
I see it differently and also know I have biases being a loyal coinkite customer. I think you guys need to check your biases especially as they pertain to foundation. I would have less to say if you guys didn’t endorse those shitheads
Nvk leveraged trezors open source software and built a better device with a secure element (trezor refused to add a secure element then attacked the concept until they folded and integrated into their devices)
Foundation ripped off coinkite’s open source code to create an almost identical ripoff which is why coinkite switched licenses
May not be an open source expert like you guys but I think I have a good understanding of the facts here
It’s not an endorsement, use whoever the fuck you want but calling foundations an identical rip off while in the same breathe praising Coldcard when they did they same is lame. If it’s shitty for foundations to do its shitty for Coldcard to do. If it’s not shitty for Coldcard to do then it’s not shitty for foundations. I have no allegiance to foundations the example is purely because they used the code from Coldcard the same way as Coldcard did to Trezor that fact you can’t see that is concerning.
I feel like I’m the twilight zone now
How are you not understanding why I feel differently about what the two companies did?
Coinkite added a secure element and allowed Airgapped functionality with PSBT support. Massive improvements over trezors offerings at the time
Did foundation improve anything?
I feel differently because I think coinkite leveraged open source code as it was intended and improved upon the original code. I haven’t seen any evidence that foundation did anything to improve the coinkite code they stole
A Passport is significantly higher quality than a Coldcard.
Literally the entire point of open source is that people can use your code.
Is System76 shit for using Ubuntu to make Pop!OS? It was intended to be copied.
if I recall correctly they c/p the repos and didnt even change the names.
which is not to say that both CK and Foundation didnt do a lot of work,
they totally did.
this is how FOSS works and its why it makes it a robust model.
nvk doesn't understand that or doesn't care or whatever.
He understands,
Money hungry that is all.
Mental gymnastics are pretty incredible here
It is now bad to build a business that makes money?
Nvk leveraged trezor open source code to build a better product with a secure element.
Coldcard was open source until some shitty company you guys continue to endorse decided they would ripoff open source code to build an almost identical product with no real improvements
No one said that,
He built his entire market share and word of mouth sales from the Open Source community.
He's a money hungry tyrant manlet who wasn't loved enough as a child.
Would respect your criticism a lot more if you had the same things to say about foundation
Pretty telling you endorse them but trash coinkite
I ENDORSE ALL OPEN SOURCE HWWS.
WHAT DONT YOU UNDERSTAND?!
MY OFFICIAL ENDORSEMENT ONLY GOES TO SEEDSIGNER BECAUSE ITS THE ONLY DEVICE THAT ISNT PACKAGED BEFOREHAND BY HUMANS TO USE WITH YOUR BITCOINS.
GFY 🙏🖖🫂
Are the raspberry pi’s you run the seedsigner software on open source?
OMG you really are a dumbcunt wow.
*TAKES THE CONVERSATION ANYWHERE TO SOOTH EGO*
How's your secure element? Not open source buddy lmfao.
Are you saying coldcard can’t be trusted?
I'm saying we don't want to live in a world where government licenses are wielded against Bitcoin companies & individuals.
https://redmonk.com/sogrady/2018/09/10/tragedy-of-the-commons-clause/
QR signing wasnt an innovation on top of Coldcard????
Are you this much of a dumbcunt?!
He also stated QR signing was insecure, lied about it, and then made his own QR signing device.
QR signing was invented by Specter, then actually implemented by SeedSigner then used by Foundation with an SE.
Btw NVK then had to admit QR signing was as secure as using a new SD card for every transaction using the coldcard.
He then added NFC !!!! Lmao the most insecure method in the world!!!!!
I like Bitaxe’s model. Bitaxe (Skot) receives opensats grant, they publish the Bitaxe schematic, you can manufacture Bitaxes, then you can kick back Skot what you like.
Lots of Bitcoiners have enough resources to just let everyone in the community work together and benefit. This enables us to scale super fast with passionate people. I don’t like the whole, I-made-it-I-control-everything-about-it-and-every-iteration-that-comes-from-it, mentality.
Imagine some dude who slid 12 text-punched washers onto a stainless steel bolt started to try and license everyone making fireproof tubes with imprinted seed phrases.
Exactly,
NVK is super wealthy already - just a money hungry manlet.
I agree FOSS benefits the entire ecosystem since people can build and iterate off each other’s collective work.
The point I was making is that someone was calling Foundations unethical for using Coinkite code when it was FOSS before they changed it to source viewable. But Coinkite literally used Trezor code. So if you think Foundations is unethical then by default you would have to think Coinkite is unethical too since they did the same to Trezor.
Shouldn’t be any double standards.
Trezor sells bitcoin only wallets and states that that’s the best option for security if you only want to hold bitcoin.
Literally the entire fucking point of open source is that you rip off others and they rip off you. That’s literally the whole fucking point.
I have a Trezor and want a Foundation. I have never and will never consider a coinkite.
SeedSigner
Bitbox
Foundation Passport
Trezor
All are Open Source.
😂 lol
Daaaaaamn!!!
Savage burn 🔥
😂🤣
If it was I’d have been getting some of that money… 💰
kind: burn 🔥
Oh my……. 😦😂
Their website wasn't sketchy enough to make people wonder?
Sadly, there will be others.
lolllll
nostr:note13yvfr4cgjjrleltrkqclte90sk43ped6qkmgycxfush45xkwdjxs7dvtnk
Bro you are part of this, such a slimeball you are.
https://ten31.vc/home#portfolio
Scroll down swan is in there.
I'm still working through the list of people I got to use swan, off of swan 😮💨
damn. this hits hard.
nostr:nprofile1qqsfjy740njx22434k0q7gq9yplfgw73s775hyt868t9cr8vlnft7tcvhlt43 is Ricky Gervais but from America and on a platform with up to 400 daily active users.
SPICY
I was going to use Swan but kept procrastinating.
💀
Indeed 
No, they were funded by Odell & Marty.
That’s money right here 🎯
😆
☠️
Oof.
Odell choosing violence
I’m late to the party… what happened?
😂 😂 😂 😂 😂
Shots fired!!
I'm a strike and fold user now. I used to use Swan.
Fuck presidents that launch shitcoins!
Shots fired🦉
you were one of their earliest investors...why shit on them now
was? Are they gone?
shot's fired.... 
It sure seems that way to me now.
Banger 💥
Ouch 😎
Backfire
SO WHY YOU INVESTED IN SWAN?
Gotcha so selling your shares then now you know what they are?
Probably better to cut ties completely is they truely are what you say they are.
THAT WOULD REQUIRE A BUYER.
😂
How so?
🤣🤣🤣