Some weeks ago I was reading Thoreau's "On the Duty of Civil Disobedience" aloud at bed-time to my son, who of course does not understand it but appreciates the sound of the words all the same, when I discovered that its famous title was in fact not the original! The original title was significantly more radical: "Resistance to Civil Government."

It's quite short, and I would encourage everyone here to read (or re-read) it. It is still tremendously relevant. Re-reading it with the original (un-sanitized) title in mind, it lands even harder.

These days, Thoreau would probably get his door kicked in.

Here's a free link to the Project Gutenberg copy: https://www.gutenberg.org/files/71/71-h/71-h.htm

Share your favorite quotes, after reading.

Reply to this note

Please Login to reply.

Discussion

🫔

Will do. Thanks.

He'd at least be banned from Twitter and other social media.

Right. Thoreau literature would be labeled misinformation.

Walden is so good, but you're right. He would be labeled an Anti-American, anti-consumerism extremist.

if you do an audiobook, it would sell. a lot. make ā€œSnowden reads Therouxā€, nostr exclusive, bitcoin only.

#nostr audio books read by your person of choice is an amazing product.

Just added to the list.

Thanks for the suggestion. Will check it out. Even Thoreau though could likely never have imagined the current clown state of the world.

ā€œI heartily accept the motto, ā€˜That government is best which governs not at all’.ā€

That's one of the best quotes ever.

Thank you … it’s a good book. Simplify, Simplify - Thoreau…. Not sure why he said it twice.

I just cheated (sorta) by buying the audiobook version so I can listen to it at work, thank you for the suggestion

šŸ«‚

Will give it a read! Also thanks for the suggestion to come over to Nostr. Dig the vibe!

ā€œI heartily accept the motto, — ā€˜That government is best which governs least’; and I should like to see it acted up to more rapidly and systematically.ā€ - Thoreau

ā€žUnder a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also a prison.ā€œ

ā€œIt does not settle the West. It does not educate. The character inherent in the American people has done all that has been accomplished; and it would have done somewhat more, if the government had not sometimes got in its way.ā€

Good one

realmente si

All men recognize the right of revolution; that is, the right to refuse allegiance to and to resist the government, when its tyranny or its inefficiency are great and unendurable.

They think that, if they should resist, the remedy would be worse than the evil. But it is the fault of the government itself that the remedy is worse than the evil.

ā€œThe only obligation which I have a right to assume is to do at any time what I think right.ā€ Reminds me on Kant’s concept of the categorical imperativ

TIL: "Resistance to Civil Government", also known as "Civil Disobedience", is an essay written by American transcendentalist Henry David Thoreau in 1849.

In the essay, Thoreau argues that individuals should not permit governments to overrule or atrophy their consciences, and that they have a duty to avoid allowing such acquiescence to enable the government to make them the agents of injustice. He was motivated in part by his disgust with slavery and the Mexican–American War.

Thoreau asserts that because governments are typically more harmful than helpful, they cannot be justified by majority opinion, or the consent of the governed. He contends that people's first obligation is to do what they believe is right and not to follow the law dictated by the majority. When a government is unjust, people should refuse to follow the law and distance themselves from the government in general.

Thoreau’s doctrine of civil disobedience influenced numerous worldwide figures including Mahatma Gandhi, Martin Luther King Jr., and many others. It continues to inspire and inform protests and civil resistance to unjust laws.

This is amazing.

It’s an absolute fantastic read and one I go to back very often. Such an inspirational and truthful observation of reality.

The establishment would at least appreciate one thing about Thoreauā€˜s writing. That would be the minimalist principles and lifestyle he spoke so fondly of and advocates for. Eat bugs and live in a hut isn’t that right?

ā€œThe only obligation which I have a right to assume, is to do at any time what I think right.ā€

nostr:npub1h8nk2346qezka5cpm8jjh3yl5j88pf4ly2ptu7s6uu55wcfqy0wq36rpev have you done a read of it or would you consider doing it?

This has literally been on my list for over a year to revisit but I’d never gotten to it.

Thanks for the tip, its now on my short list.

Leaving the blue bird for the purple bird feels hard- like leaving a concert for a backyard BBQ. Mostly FOMO keeps me on the other platform. But as more good content comes this way I’m excited to be here more.

It begs the question...

what is America to do when most if not all of their founding fathers and early national leaders would all be put on a terrorist watch list by the current federal bureaucracy? it would seem that an adjustment is in order.

This book is amazing and also read it to my kids. They will understand it someday as they become older.

is this a good summary by Chat GPT:

"The summarized version of "On the Duty of Civil Disobedience" by Henry David Thoreau is as follows:

Thoreau argues that the best government is the one that governs least and suggests that the ideal government is one that doesn't govern at all. He criticizes the inefficiency and abuse of power by governments, comparing them to standing armies. Thoreau believes that the American government is losing its integrity and questions its ability to fulfill its purpose. He emphasizes the importance of individual conscience and suggests that people should prioritize doing what is morally right over blindly obeying the law. Thoreau criticizes the government's involvement in slavery and the Mexican war, asserting that people have the right to resist an unjust government. He concludes by urging individuals to act with integrity and not to rely on the government for necessary reforms."

I agree with all that he said, but... He would be dead the next day.

Thanks for the interpretation. Edward always finds things that make no sense and you need a dictionary to understand what he's writing about. I get it now. However for me personally I want to respect and understand our Government and obey and be on the good side of the law but the Bullies and abusive law enforcement officers under FBI/CIA make it impossible for a good citizen to be on the good side. Imagine the old days when they used to beat citizens in the streets by getting out of their transport and practice exercise by walking themselves. Like pushing a woman in poverty in the dirt and telling her she will never be one of them. Never get to the palace of the White House. Nowadays they change the law and you have to research the information yourself. And they accuse you of breaking a law that you didn't even know existed. Nowadays they physically drive by you 24/7. Your body is broken Your vision losing sight.. until eventually there is nothing left for you but forever slavery.

"I heartily accept the motto,ā€”ā€œThat government is best which governs least;ā€ and I should like to see it acted up to more rapidly and systematically. Carried out, it finally amounts to this, which also I believeā€”ā€œThat government is best which governs not at all;ā€ and when men are prepared for it, that will be the kind of government which they will have."

JUST THE OPENING SENTENCES THAT I HAD READ BEING QUOTED BY RUDOLF ROCKER.

Thanks nostr:npub1sn0wdenkukak0d9dfczzeacvhkrgz92ak56egt7vdgzn8pv2wfqqhrjdv9.

Civil Disobedience and Other Essays. An e-book by Henry David Thoreau on Anna's Archive.

https://annas-archive.org/md5/9662c99196e0816e91ad06a51fc10608

I love you papa Snow!

"The objections which have been brought against a standing army, and they are many and weighty, and deserve to prevail, may also at last be brought against a standing government."

It's a thing of beauty.

Doubtful. Not enough of a threat. He'd still be considered the deadbeat moocher friend by his acquaintances. Like he was when alive.

šŸ”„

ā€œCan there not be a government in which majorities do not virtually decide right and wrong, but conscience?- in which majorities decide only those questions to which the rule of expediency is applicable? Must the citizen ever for a moment, or in the least degree, resign his conscience to the legislation? Why has every man a conscience, then? I think that we should be men first, and subjects afterwardlā€

Thanks! Very interesting quote

Wonder what he would make of Satoshi and the cypherpunks and their very expedient rule

Even echoes all the wrangling over bitcoin consensus presently--and hyperbitcoinization hasn't even set in yet!

"There will never be a really free and enlightened State, until the State comes to recognize the individual as a higher and independent power, from which all its own power and authority are derived, and treats him accordingly."

I love that you are sharing this, thank you... and reading Thoreau to your son.... I've yet to read completely, but "I went to the woods because I wished to live deliberately, to front only the essential facts of life, and see if I could not learn what it had to teach, and not, when I came to die, discover that I had not lived" reminds me of David Whyte speaking about the conversational nature of reality and living at that frontier, the edge of that... the depth, plethora of life.

Have you read VĆ”clav Havel's The Power of the Powerless? ā¤ļø

Thanks Ed. Great essay that I hadn’t read before. Should read some Thoreau.

Here from twitter because of you Mr. Snowden. The more people wake up the more they realize how much of hero you really are.

Thank you, this was great to go back to, def enjoy more now than 30 yrs ago…..

ā€œMust the citizen ever for a moment, or in the least degree, resign his conscience to the legislator? Why has every man a conscience, then?ā€

ā€œHowever, the government does not concern me much, and I shall bestow the fewest possible thoughts on it. It is not many moments that I live under a government, even in this world. If a man is thought-free, fancy-free, imagination-free, that which is not never for a long time appearing to be to him, unwise rulers or reformers cannot fatally interrupt himā€

"For eighteen hundred years, though perchance I have no right to say it, the New Testament has been written; yet where is the legislator who has wisdom and practical talent enough to avail himself of the light which it sheds on the science of legislation."

in the world not of it

does the hamster control the wheel, or does the wheel control the hamster?

is the circle broken or unbroken?

Perhaps it simply is.

Have read. Thoreau also went to jail for not paying taxes on moral grounds (he was an abolitionist).

jail for him was better living quarters than his cabin. Thoreau was a normalfag.

"I was put into jail as I was going to the shoemaker’s to get a shoe which was mended. When I was let out the next morning, I proceeded to finish my errand, and, having put on my mended shoe, joined a huckleberry party, who were impatient to put themselves under my conduct; and in half an hour,—for the horse was soon tackled,—was in the midst of a huckleberry field, on one of our highest hills, two miles off; and then the State was nowhere to be seen." -H.D.T.

"I was not born to be forced. I will breathe after my own fashion. Let us see who is the strongest. What force has a multitude? They only can force me who obey a higher law than I."

"All men recognize the right of revolution; that is, the right to refuse allegiance to and to resist the government, when its tyranny or its inefficiency are great and unendurable."

"There are nine hundred and ninety-nine patrons of virtue to one virtuous man; but it is easier to deal with the real possessor of a thing than with the temporary guardian of it."

Thoreau is one of the greatest šŸ™šŸ¾

hello world

In the pages of history, a voice rings clear,

"On the Duty of Civil Disobedience" we hold dear.

Thoreau's timeless words, a call to defy,

To question authority, to reach for the sky.

In the realm of ideas, his pen took flight,

A seed of rebellion, a beacon of light.

He spoke of injustice, of a world gone astray,

And urged us to rise, to find our own way.

Through the act of civil disobedience, he preached,

To challenge the norms, the boundaries breached.

To stand against oppression, with unwavering might,

And fight for justice, with all our collective sight.

His words resonate still, as time marches on,

For injustice persists, and battles still need to be won.

In a world divided, where voices are suppressed,

Thoreau's message endures, calling us to protest.

From the suffragette movement to civil rights,

From environmental activism to equality's fights,

Thoreau's words inspire, igniting the flame,

Empowering the masses to challenge and reclaim.

In the face of injustice, let us not be silent,

But stand tall and defiant, with hearts resilient.

For in civil disobedience, a power lies untamed,

To reshape the world, where justice is named.

Though times have changed, and progress we've seen,

The duty remains, to question and intervene.

To challenge authority, when principles are at stake,

For civil disobedience, our voices we must make.

So let us turn the pages of Thoreau's tome,

And find inspiration in every word and poem.

For "On the Duty of Civil Disobedience" still rings true,

Guiding us forward, in everything we pursue.

i love it that you're reading it to him nostr:npub1sn0wdenkukak0d9dfczzeacvhkrgz92ak56egt7vdgzn8pv2wfqqhrjdv9! it's the ultimate book ("essay").. i'm not quite sure why people bothered to publish anything ever since.. šŸ™„

https://twitter.com/ronnie_barkan/status/1564011649731887104

"The progress from an absolute to a limited monarchy, from a limited monarchy to a democracy, is a progress toward a true respect for the individual. " Rather self contradictory document; Monarch is intended to protect the individual and provide a suitably liable party, as in suitably knowing and with enough *vomit* Gold that a penalty could actually be imposed upon them for not protecting the rights of the citizen.

Outsourcing the work and liability of governance to the public who cannot afford the cost of its own actions (vote) protected the British Crown from (and others) from the intended system of liability for the acts of citizens onto other citizens. Given the the US and Australia both started as prison colonies it is ironic to see a system of law developed by criminals for criminals enforced by criminals and resisted by those too dumb to opt out.

The US claims it is legally established as a vassal state of the Swiss republic; while the Swiss can likely afford the costs of their own actions and until recently seemed able to hold a vote / democracy there is no doubt that they cannot afford to pay for the illegal actions of either of our former employers.

It's not within the origin of intents that citizens have to revolt against the systems of governance to ovoid liability; yet it is the reality of the world as is if your not fighting against the crimes of such criminal governance than you are in fact the very implement that is expected to pay in forced labor. All of this sounded well and good to industrialists but in an age of modern automated manufacturing factories don't even turn the lights on; let alone employee human labor.

Democracy truly is the superior way to render the Human responsible for the actions of governance and its own conditions...

I have a story you should hear. If I send it to your inbox will you read it?

This pairs tightly with Emerson's "Self Reliance":

https://www.gutenberg.org/files/16643/16643-h/16643-h.htm#SELF-RELIANCE

Thoreau was more about action and Emerson more about ideas, so they complement each other well.

Some quotes from the above:

"Whoso would be a man must be a nonconformist"

"To believe your own thought, to believe that what is true for you in your private heart is true for all men,—that is genius."

"There is a time in every man's education when he arrives at the conviction that envy is ignorance; that imitation is suicide; that he must take himself for better, for worse, as his portion; that though the wide universe is full of good, no kernel of nourishing corn can come to him but through his toil bestowed on that plot of ground which is given to him to till. The power which resides in him is new in nature, and none but he knows what that is which he can do, nor does he know until he has tried."

I’m currently reading and enjoying the book! Delicious quotes too šŸ¤˜šŸ»

Reading now. You can download other formats, such as ePub from here: http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/71

Edward fucking Snowden. Why haven't you killed yourself yet?

lands

Why do not you use your super powers to arrest Bernard Kerik, Larry Silverstein, Paul Bremer, and the other goons who blew up WTC7 ?

Why are you the apparition of a principled whistleblower, but in fact, a useless app influencer?

Mr Snowden you are truly a hero of our times. Great respect and admiration for your courage. You made history with Assange et Manning. I wish you the best.

Civil disobedience Is still trending in USA. Today I saw someone wear a t shirt that said I belong here she was black. Then on my way to the store there was yet another bumper sticker that said Locally Hated. Yeah that's obvious. There's also talks about language barriers and Need to write in a way other people can understand what I'm writing about. But shouldn't most people have a translation option?

Dearest Edward: I’m curious to know what you found most compelling about the arguments presented in this book? Do you think that civil disobedience is an effective way to bring about social change in today’s world?

This document is a classic American essay by Thoreau in which he expresses his philosophy and criticises the state. It has influenced many social movements and thinkers. However, it has some weaknesses and contradictions in his argumentation and some assumptions and prejudices that he does not explain or justify. What are your thoughts on this?

Firstly, Thoreau's essay is a powerful call for civil disobedience, but it is not the only way to resist injustice. There are many examples of peaceful and effective social movements that have changed the world without using violence or breaking laws. Here a few examples: https://www.globalcitizen.org/en/content/peace-protests-dallas-response/

5 Peaceful Protests That Led to Social and Political Changes (globalcitizen.org)

Secondly, Civil disobedience is not a panacea for every problem. It depends on the context, the consequences and the alternatives. Before you decide to follow Thoreau's advice, ask yourself: Is this the best way to achieve my goal? What are the risks and benefits? Are there other options? Think critically and act responsibly.

Thirdly, Thoreau wrote his essay in a different time and place than we do. He was reacting to specific problems he faced, such as slavery and the Mexican-American War. His arguments may not be applicable to our situation today or may need to be updated or modified. Do not take his words as gospel, but question them, challenge them and compare them with other perspectives.

Fourthly, Thoreau had a noble vision of a government based on conscience and justice, not majority rule or expediency. But he also recognised that such a government was not yet possible and that people were not yet ready for it. He did not reject all forms of government, but he wanted a better one. How can we work together to create a more just and democratic society? How can we improve our existing institutions and laws? How can we hold our leaders accountable?

Fithly, Thoreau was a man of principle, but also a man of privilege. He could afford to break the law and go to jail because he had friends who supported him and bailed him out. He did not have to fear losing his job, his family or his life. He also did not think about the impact of his crime on others who might suffer even more than he did. How can we balance our individual rights and responsibilities with our social duties and responsibilities? How can we stand up for ourselves without harming others?

Coucou

test

test 2

test 3

test 1

I started it years ago and didn't finish. Thanks for the reminder. Glad to see you on nostr.

When is Glenn going to join us? šŸ™‚

I read Trudeau at first šŸ˜‚

Damn, I've always wondered which of the Russian-speaking YouTubers Snowden subscribed to

Yo shits weird, why she being so creepy and spiking my anxiety (971)-427-8565

My digits but I'm being real this is overwhelming me and to me unexplainable? Are you even able to know why? Why is this Tom shit still popping up? That just turbulent? Or shes being harrased by someone? I need answers as she is still helping them cut me down and im not mad but concerned! She didn't choose soulmate cause her aggressive neverending weird

Just realized this thing named me frightened mite? Lol that's so cute cause I'm not the one frightened rather anxious but shes so got me, shes frightened? By who? Who? Can ya name one real person? O need name's! Theuy NSA local DEA? So they hurt her physically again? Why frightene? For me? Ph court? They say they gomna kill me? Lol amd? Cause shes seen them kill before? Must have! Naw something else

My life safer tham safe ik fact too safe its just set ups to lead me into trouble!

I need to move that is clear but how? Everything is too good to be true. J is overly obnoxious. I've got him hooked to help in places I cannot go like Robin Hood.

Thoreau's 'On the Duty of Civil Disobedience' argues that individuals have a moral obligation to resist unjust laws and government actions. It emphasizes the importance of personal conscience, nonviolent protest, and the pursuit of justice. A thought-provoking call to question authority and take action for a better society. #CivilDisobedience #JusticeForAll

If we don’t resist mass surveillance and control it will just happen.

LinkedIn sends me red letter messages every time I report on the cops

The director was mad that I wouldn't accept his financial scam calling it not taking help from the FBI. That's not why I was posting to the FBI. I told them about sheriffs dept physically surrounding me 24/7. And that's what I needed help with. This is the 2nd time the other person refused to show me who they were. And pressured me to take their advise. I told them my story and instead of helping me stop Dottie Bollinger calling me it continued and she was still calling Me. I know you and Ryan deadpool and J.

Glenn is in Florida but I'm not getting my emails. I'm having bank problems. Money problems. The bank called it activity on the account. I'm a domestic violent victim and it's escalating. Surrounded by sheriffs dept. no one safe is calling me or willing to talk with me in a phone call.

"But, to speak practically and as a citizen, unlike those who call themselves no-government men, I ask for, not at once no government, but at once a better government. Let every man make known what kind of government would command his respect, and that will be one step toward obtaining it."

Awesome, thanks for sharing!

Gray law enforcement jeep suv with a dog

It's been a few years since I read it. I recall enjoying watching Thoreau pull apart any idea of state morality and legitimacy. If you want a modern-day account of the same to read to your son may I suggest Larken Rose's, "The Most Dangerous Superstition"? It's a bit longer but 100% šŸ”„

Oops I spoke imprecisely... I meant Thoreau pulled apart even any idea of even a democratic state being a replacement for personal morality or conscience.

"There will never be a really free and enlightened state until the state comes to recognize the individual as a higher and independent power, from which all its own power and authority are derived."

Henry David Thoreau, Civil Disobedience

Yarvin might be right.

I used to read Thoreau a few years ago and found it a little pretentious and fake.

Did he spend a year in the wood? Not really. His mom was 20 mn away and liked to cook him cookies. Did he really protest the Mexican war and refused to pay taxes for it? Not sure it was effective when rich people in his town paid for him :)

I listened to your interview with Jack Dorsey where you mentioned that you read ā€œbig kidā€ books to your kids at night (like the book mentioned above). I’ve been reading kids books to my kids and they are getting bored of them. I guess it’s time to graduate to the next level! Thanks for the idea.

Thoreau has always been one of my inspiration sources since my youth. Perhaps that's where my rebellious spirit comes from šŸ˜€