Is there anyone actively working on a wikipedia alternative for nostr?
Discussion
It’s been talked about for months. Nothing I’ve seen.
Whoever does, I hope they call it kiwipedia and have the kiwi bird as the logo
Some ppl may interpret that the wrong way and associate it with a certain other kiwi site lol.
Not yet. But it could be a fork of Habla.news
Not exactly the same, but nostr:npub1l2vyh47mk2p0qlsku7hg0vn29faehy9hy34ygaclpn66ukqp3afqutajft ‘s nostr:npub1w0rthyjyp2f5gful0gm2500pwyxfrx93a85289xdz0sd6hyef33sh2cu4x looks like it could be a seed for something like this.
Wikipedia is a shitcoin.
Yes, nostr:npub1m3xdppkd0njmrqe2ma8a6ys39zvgp5k8u22mev8xsnqp4nh80srqhqa5sf is working on something called indextr https://github.com/limina1/indextr-client/tree/main
Thank you nostr:npub1r30l8j4vmppvq8w23umcyvd3vct4zmfpfkn4c7h2h057rmlfcrmq9xt9ma 🫂
Ideas to think about:
1) what would a decentralized Wikipedia look like?
2) why would anyone use this over a regular Wikipedia?
3) how can such a system leverage the affordances provided by Nostr?
4) can it be a place to help understand academic papers? how can we help remove barriers in academia? Can we address the ever increasing rate of papers being published, no doubt a growing portion will be published with the assistance of AI (covertly given the incentives of the current system) creating a diluted information landscape?
This framework of knowledge attempts to address some of these questions. Its super early, but I'm hopeful this can is a positive path forward.
By addressing these questions this framework no longer is just another Wikipedia, or just another note taking app. Its a framework for knowledge management, highly interoperable with use cases that span the range from personal knowledge management to full academic articles and then some
Man imagine the option to zap a few sats every time you need to look something up instead of them groveling and begging for a donation every time you open the website. 🧠🧠🧠
Imagine being able to pay a few sats every time you need confirmation of your opinion.
Hey man if a quick wiki search helps me win an argument or something, then that deserves a zap 🤷♂️🤷♂️
Wikipedia is full of lies. If you want to win an argument, ask nostr:npub13wfgha67mdxall3gqp2hlln7tc4s03w4zqhe05v4t7fptpvnsgqs0z4fun to say you're right.
I understand why people try to convert everything to Nostr, it's fun. But sometimes it's just an old man's desire to move the old web to new rails.
Imagine begging for a donation, subscription, showing ads, AND the option to zap every time you open the website.
The option to zap sounds good, but my imagination isn't telling me how it'd displace other mechanisms for monetizing "content". How would it?
Agreed. Bit more complex than just adding nostr/zaps.
Still whoring for ads and donos is a great way for me to never send a zap.
Free and open source tech with free information would perhaps make competition more robust, increasing the quality of the presentation of info.
Idk though I’m just here for the ride.
Monetization of content is easy if you steer clear of crypto. Witness how easy it is to reward content creators on tiktok, afreeca.tv. likey, kofi, OF, absolutely no friction. No tech debt. It took me 15 seconds to figure it out.
👍 Lots to learn from our friends in Asia on monetization esp Korean Cultural Technology
I faintly remember someone in the Nostr matrix chat mentioning something of this sort. Unfortunately I lost track of it...
Hey Jack,
We’re not working on that however we have a project called From Bars To Bitcoin on nostr:npub1dccj58jgxvhrf9xfmuw8d2zt8v37zd5wqn8f0hyfsm52hcu84uzqn5qdql.
Where we going inside prisons and educate people on bitcoin and employment in bitcoin mining.
My nonprofit is nostr:npub1nvn6z8xshjj0rnshpflxy2mft9eynrrtvmhtc8kk2cc0eatcacnq80at83
We’re in your DMs as well.
Interesting
We should crowdfund some incentives 👀
Pretty sure nostr:npub180cvv07tjdrrgpa0j7j7tmnyl2yr6yr7l8j4s3evf6u64th6gkwsyjh6w6 started on one
great idea jack 🦩
He discusses some alternative web projects already ongoing:
This is fantastic, TDLR: the cofounder of Wikipedia mentions how alternative health and politics is evidently tampered with on Wikipedia and his new project to try and combat that by aggregating >30 encyclopedias here https://encycloreader.org and https://encyclosearch.org you can add this as a custom search in your firefox flavoured browser eg Librewolf by right clicking in the encycloreader search box and selecting add keyword search, then add eg. 'e' as the keyword and whenever you type 'e ' followed by a search term in your address bar you could search all 30+ encyclopedias without going through Google that downranks the more independent ones.
that would be EPIC
👀
nostr:note197gwlnyq0tz3nsnfyrwqtvw0xq346xewhvr2aapak7m9kcjgn44svxz9pw
nostrpedia?
Greta idea
Old #bullshit 😐, same old #bullshit but in #Nostr 🤯
You could check what I had just said about making a WIKIPEDIA in NOSTR:
That is a very awesome idea.
If someone is already working in that, and need a extra hands, say something. I really love the old Wikipedia, but why not a more descentralize one?
I’m happy to help if you’ll give me a nudge in the right direction, what are you thinking ?
I have something in mind for an app I created as part of my bachelor thesis on a data collection and curation platform, the grid.
https://github.com/nourspace/uol-final-the-grid
It currently uses a regular database. So I'm thinking to implement a nostr<>grid-db component. Relays want to host a grid instance should run this component to sync grid entries with nostr notes.
I believe there are other ways like filing a NIP and tweaking the ui so it communiates with relays direcrly, or using ndk? I have not done any nostr development yet.
I like the idea of having a GraphQl endpoint as it allows for building richer ui components.
nostr:npub1l2vyh47mk2p0qlsku7hg0vn29faehy9hy34ygaclpn66ukqp3afqutajft nostr:npub1gcxzte5zlkncx26j68ez60fzkvtkm9e0vrwdcvsjakxf9mu9qewqlfnj5z I would love to hear your thoughts.
Get Larry Sanger and Encyclosphere connected with nostr!!
😎🤓
nostr:npub1t3ggcd843pnwcu6p4tcsesd02t5jx2aelpvusypu5hk0925nhauqjjl5g4 bought the domain nostrwiki.com but what’s up there now is just a placeholder. We need developers to take things to the next level and build a native application. nostr:npub1v6xwae25wh6etmqw3m6yce9lnk5dnhtqpzk9fhxjfvjsryctjc8q2kxk5t nostr:npub1m3xdppkd0njmrqe2ma8a6ys39zvgp5k8u22mev8xsnqp4nh80srqhqa5sf nostr:npub13cnlldwfhwxd6qf34hnwlfya2m2qrd2zfk0alxnrup6d2fasw9wqxwkzpe
that would be absolutely incredible ❤️
i dream of this happening
As a student and researcher, the potentials of Nostr have been on my mind since February and I've since been thinking about how a nostr-native wiki could work.
Its the second week of my semester back in school and I've since pivoted my research towards knowledge management. Almost everything I am doing this semester is related to knowledge management. Ultimately intend to bring the ideas that I'm learning to nostr through indextr.
Add on DVM's for processing/analyzing notes and articles or finding links between knowledge that may not have been found, now we're cooking up something special here.
If/when, should it be named Nostrpedia, Wikistr, or Wikstr?
I’m working on a Nostr version of Internet Archive and anticipate that a lot of what i learn from that could be used towards a nostr-based Wikipedia.
Nostrpedia
NosDAV should eventually be able to handle it. It's basically a port of Solid (Social Linked Data) to Nostr.
What is allows is users to read a page, edit a page, create a page, delete a page etc. You can also set the access control so that others get edit permission, or even the whole world gets edit permission.
Rather than put the whole of wikipedia in a relay, which would take up a lot of space, it allows pages to be created on a compliant web server, with authentication via NIP-98.
It already supports markdown, but I've not put in the WebAccessControl NAV yet, but it'll look alot like UNIX permissions. You could then quite quickly start a markdown thing similar to the original wikipedia, but with nostr users. There's a few tricks to make it slightly more decentralied too.
But I guess you want censorship resistance. Might be possible since it's federated out of the box. But even federated has single points of failure. A more content addressable part similar to IPFS could be done. There could be some censorship resistant pages on relays, but then you need bigger relays.
Nice idea, in any case.
Wikipedia censorship comes in the form of competing edits, where ideologically opposed individuals engage in narrative combat. How would such disagreement be resolved? My rough thought on this topic is to enable content to be composable by users based on competing sources using whatever client-side filtering and whitelisting desired by the user. (Same as the Primal content moderation model for Nostr.)
each user can choose which edit they want
or flavour but flavors will need a strong hand. You can think of Wikipedia.org as the Wikipedia Flavour…
nostr:npub1melv683fw6n2mvhl5h6dhqd8mqfv3wmxnz4qph83ua4dk4006ezsrt5c24 where the NosDAV code?
the main point of nostr is any flavor cant censor easily if at all, for example there would certainly have been deleted conversations on wikipedia
💯
⚡️ incentives / requirement for some flavours (relay or relay network) would be real nice for quality control and incentivization.
Thinking about how this might work and I’m wondering pay sats to the author referenced in the footnote?
Editor/contributor splits could
be calculated on the amount of edits on the article.
Also thinking there needs to be some split between the flavour maintainers (like centralized org such as wikipedia foundation) and the editor/contributors (decentralized)
Then how to incentivize relays to host and howto incentivize editors to contribute? ⚡️ tipping, ⚡️ subscription or some form of ⚡️mining would be interesting. Also what about article bounties? ha! People contribute ⚡️ to areas of knowledge or specific articles to grow them. Brainstorm…
Had another thought, since wikipedia accounts are completely created with extremely no/low cost which allows some untold # of bad actors, using nostr pub/priv keys is no brainer plugin, as the unpaid editors (well paid in altruism) now currently are the primary spam deterrent.
Augmenting the Altruism-Coin with ⚡️ would provide some new blood into the editing system.
Anyway, this will conflict with Wikipedia culture, so only way is forward and engage on demand.
yesss
This is great effort. Compatibility with WebDAV would open up a lot of use cases and has permission model already.
nostr:npub1929tcqjxtdpgl7lvy2qegagr68ktvymrsnk7gwskesfs4vk92j0scnwqke what issues do you see?
nostr:npub1ekjq2t8zdhs4sycusarwzxas9t0jnuwusssuam5nz0f9e4cm6hqqx6ltq4 we need BrionV on here.
Not gonna happen. :/
Sounds like the bare minimum technically to implement a wiki. 99.999+% of wikis aren't wikipedia alternatives, let alone viable ones. Build "wikipedia for nostr" doesn't strike me as likely to be successful, but go for it, crazy attempts are a way to make progress, at least it can be added to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:HaeB/Timeline_of_distributed_Wikipedia_proposals
Gonna take funding no one can shoulder this alone....
ChatGpT could step in. We'll find out if the algorithm is biased for sure.
I'm gonna be real with you Jack. It does not make sense to use nostr for that. Its a protocol built around relaying messages, not holding onto them for very long.
Now DHT torrents on the other hand. People have been seeding pirated movies...and also news and information illegal in certain governments... But mostly pirated movies for a longggg time.
If you want to introduce lightning payments to pay seeders (be a great opportunity for channel factories to shine if it motivates that being developed) then that sounds great!
Real question is how to make it honest?
How about creating a disincentivizing mechanism for not being honest. Like you would have to put real Sats on the line and if you are proven to be spreading lies there is a cost for it? Should be possible now that we have Zaps.
Brilliant. Sign me up. UI dev here.
Is there something inherently wrong with Wikipedia as it is now? Doesn't seem to have problems of the same severity as social media.
but why is that necessary? Wikipedia is crowd-sourced and needs funding/donations to maintain its server. The same costs will be borne in running its relay. Just my thoughts
This is interesting, but how can you avoid biased interveniance like it happens on Wikipedia at this moment.
Hello Jack in 2019 i made this prototype website which is kind of wikipedia like but is basically decentralized keywords using SHA256 of the entered string, which can be in any language and can also include URLs.
I want to find a way to get it onto Bitcoin, so Liquid BTC public tx seems like its going to be the way, but maybe you could help me?
The data is domain name independent and at the moment I have a couple of domains pointing at it see https://www.publicdomain.live/Jack or https://www.openkeywords.com/Jack its currently running on the Telos Antelope chain but when it's using bitcoin it will be easier to get adoption because nobody has really heard of Telos and so getting their tokens for the micro transactions that create the entries is not as straightforward as using BTC will be.
I would love to hear from you or anyone who can see the potential of this project.
Google do not own our words, they are public domain!
This project enables everyone to post under any keyword without requiring a 3rd party to approve it, and it can never be censored once posted.
See how Jack Mallers is already linked from the Jack page, but Jack Dorsey is just a string. When a link is created from the Jack page to the Jack Dorsey page the string becomes hyperlinked and both posters are attributed for the creation of it, nifty eh?
The tx which created each listing is linked as is the timestamp and the link to the posters account, so reputation matters and can be cultivated over time even though the accounts are anon.
Notice the base URL to each page is the hash of the entered string, like IPFS so if two or more people post under the same keyword it lists them in reverse chronological order. Because of this method it can be said i have essentially created a public domain page for every single word, string, character, song or image, in any language ao long as it can be inputted into a computer.
Nobody really understands this or the huge benefit of what I have made and for years I have spoken to people about it and showed it and the smarter they are the me reasons they give why it won't work, but it does work, I have made it and use it every day in conjunction with my 'Private Domain Viewer' version based on the same method, one day someone else who also thinks outside the box will go 'Ohhhhhhhh i see what you made there bro, wow how did you think of that, this is brilliant! ' Until then I just stack sats and talk to people about it when something like this arises. I made a demo video where I introduce it and show the 3 things you can do with it,https://youtu.be/msPLtqih4z0?si=yrhFnnQOfvVWPhJJ
Even if I had the idea, how to go about building one for Nostr?
That is a great point