apoB and triglycerides are my only concern if you have a genetic predisposition for metabolic disease. Cholesterol measured as LDL is unreliable in indicating healthy metabolism or CVD risk. Please read or listen to Peter Attia’s series on cholesterol https://peterattiamd.com/the-straight-dope-on-cholesterol-part-i/
Cholesterol is produced and found in every cell in your body and is vital for hormone production, liver detoxification and bile production, cell and nerve signaling, healing etc.
Generally carnivore advocates report triglycerides go down even on high saturated fat keto/paleo/carnivore diets while LDL scores skyrocket (except for Ken Berry) so this may just be genetic predisposition for free cholesterol in the blood.
What we do know is that OXIDATION causes arteriosclerosis in blood vessels when LDL particles stick to blood walls and oxidize. Also important is arterial calcification, where in smokers and insulin resistant individuals (pre or diabetic) arterial walls are more prone to attract oxidized particles.
Pro-inflammatory foods such as highly-processed, toxin and antinutrient laden modern foods DO cause inflammation in the body leading to more oxidative stress and potentially cardiovascular disease. This includes most plants which don’t have claws to defend themselves or hooves to run away, so they almost always produce chemicals to deter being eaten. This is the ideology behind NOT eating these foods on these diets.
What’s reported on low-inflammation elimination diets such as these are that regardless of dietary saturated fat intake and measurable LDL (some even report 500-600mg/dL) arterial calcification scores generally go down as well.
Now is this partially due to higher satiation - more calorie and nutrient dense foods being consumed leading to more time between meals where the body has a chance to process oxidation and clean the blood via apoptosis? Is it better bioavailability of animal foods or more vitamin and mineral support for natural anti-inflammatory and detoxification pathways in the body? Or is it simply depriving the body of toxins and phytonutrients in general leading to less oxidative stress?
Nostriches eating sticks of butter and raw eggs if they do post their lipid profiles will likely be high, but this blood snapshot really doesn’t tell the right story. I’m more keen to hear reports of better mood, vitality, strength, mental acuity, and lower CAC scores personally.
More studies need to be done rather than mostly anecdotal evidence. https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0735109720356874
I appreciate the fact that there is a real research behind it not just following an internet trend. So according to you even though LDL might be high in people with a carnivore diet it won't necessarily lead to atherosclerosis plaque formation because it involves oxidation, and a low-inflammatory diet (carnivore diet) can prevent this oxidation. Hmm I feel like it's too theoretical and risky. I really don't think it's as simple as that, and in reality there might still be oxidation and plaque formation. Are there any scientific studies supporting this? With evaluations of apoB levels and CAC scanning?
Also it's mentioned in the article you shared that genetic predispositions impact the association between saturated fat consumption and cardiovascular risks. So just because a youtuber or Jack on nostr has a carnivore diet without consequences on their cardiovascular health it absolutely doesn't mean it will be the same for you.
I simply think it's too risky, and the potential benefits aren't worth it. I'd rather have less vitality, strength, and a better mood than having to get stents at 50.
Yes, not enough backed evidence IMO and the genetic mutation is a big factor to monitor if you’re predisposed. I do not know of any studies specifically looking at these measures and mechanisms.
Without a health lifestyle, it doesn’t matter either. And until further research and replicated studies, I agree it is a risk to go against what most doctors will tell you without proper supervision and regular scans/testing.
There is a dearth of people, many doctors who even disagree in the paleo/ancestral/carnivore sphere on things such as “do you need fiber”, “fat soluble vitamin toxicity”, “are fruits, honey and dairy ok”, and “impact of environmental toxins”? but most all agree insulin resistance (metabolic disease) and inflammation are the driving causes of CHD and obesity in general.
I don’t believe it’s the best diet for all people; just like I don’t believe people should live in ketosis 24/7.
Well thanks for all this info, it was really interesting. Honestly, I'm no expert when it comes to diets, I just try to keep things balanced with animal/plant proteins, fruits/vegetables, fibers but I also enjoy pasta and bread 😄
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